Re: Papal Conclave

Scientist are beginning to say that the universe is too perfect to have happened by chance.

For example, the Pole star is exactly in the centre of the Earth's axis. Why is that?

The diameter of the moon obscures the diameter of the sun during an eclipse, given it's distance from the Earth. Why is that?

Like you, I don't subscribe to the notion that God is the wrath seeking, all loving entity the various religions purport him to be. That idea is created by man, to frighten the masses into supporting that idea.

Religion has, over the millennium, been used to control the many by the few - the history books tell us that.

Serfs were told by the Lord of the manor it was good for their souls to work for seven days a week, were not taught to read and write for fear of them being able to read the Bible, had Christ's story told in pictures in the various churches and employed vicars to keep the serfs satisfied in their religious teachings.

Now we are in a more enlightened age, the masses are now able to choose for themselves and religion went into decline.

However, a hedonistic lifestyle is self-destructive and people are turning to the bible, in my view, as a guide to living a decent life, but that still doesn't alter the fact that religion has started more wars and conflict in this world than any other single entity.

Re: Papal Conclave

A man had 4 sons. Three became priests and one became a doctor.

One morning the doctor said to his father, "I had a strange dream last night, I thought that I died and went to Hell"
"What was it like?", asked his father.

"Just like home - you couldn't get near the fire for bloody priests!"

Re: Papal Conclave

Fogey, the universe is the way it is at the minute. In many years to come, and in fact many years ago, it will be different. The universe is expanding, astronomical bodies are moving relative to one another.
The pole star will not always be over the Earth's axis, the moon is moving slowly in its orbit, the Sun will burn out.

Long before that happens we will all die and when we're gone, we're gone.
How we choose to live before that happens, is to a large extent up to us, but God has nothing to do with it.

Re: Papal Conclave

Which rather defeats your argument that we were all given 'free will'.

Re: Papal Conclave

Free will in life no one suggests we have any choice after death. Although I like to think we get a personal heaven as mine would be full of dogs and cats.

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I'm not saying one way or the other, so please don't shoot the messenger regarding the universe. I too, believe when we are gone, we are gone and have scant time for people who say I will be damned if I don't believe in God.

However, I do accept that people do believe in God and follow the diktats of their respective religion - as long as they don't try to cram it down my throat, then live and let live is my motto.

Knock on my door and spout the bible at me and I will give very short shrift, I promise you.

Re: Papal Conclave

Re: Papal Conclave

As another example of what I mean when I say perfection, look up Leonardo Fibonacci and see how every living thing on this planet falls under what was known as 'The Divine Proportions', which is now known as 'The Golden Ratio'.

Re: Papal Conclave

My goodness, and I thought the debates in our family were interesting... we have Catholics, recovering Catholics, born-again Christians, pagans and Wiccans in our numbers. Mixed marriages. All welcome, all tolerated, all willing to jump into lively discussion if religion raises its head... but we respect each other's beliefs.

I abandoned organized religion some time ago though I sometimes browse and read up on various ones out of interest.

Love one another. Live and let live. An ye harm no one, do as ye will.

Re: Papal Conclave

Something I find quite lovely and worthy of appreciation. I need not question why it is so.