Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

Good article on why we'll have to swallow a lot more unpleasant things than our pride if we want a post Brexit trade deal with the US.

http://https://www.independent.co.uk...-a8295141.html

"First, we’ll have to take the chlorinated chicken, the genetically modified wheat, cloned meat and beef stuffed full of hormones – or we’ll be stuffed if we want to sell the Americans our steel, Range Rovers, Jaguars, Rolls-Royce aero engines, armaments, banking and other services. With an inevitable loss of trade and markets in Europe, we will have little choice – if we wish to retain living standards – but to submit to what the US demands."

So much for independence and making our own choices, thanks for nothing, Brexiters.

"But even if we agree to import all this stuff, we don’t have to buy it, do we (you may ask)? We can just buy British or “farm assured”, surely?

Yes and no. The US objects to COOL (“Country of Origin Labelling”) as it can refer to “country of birth, fattening, and slaughter of animals; country of milking, packaging, or processing for dairy products; and country of cultivation and processing for wheat”.

So post-Brexit, chances are you’ll be shopping blind, unable to avoid genetically modified American “cheddar”, even if you wanted to."

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

Hi

Simple fact of life.

We have no need of a Trade Deal with the USA, we manage perfectly well without one.

What we do need is a Trade Deal with the EU, and they need one with us.

We also need to replicate the existing Trade Deals with the 40 odd Countries we have as being part of the EU.

That will protect our Industry and Agriculture, things will carry on as normal.

We will lose Financial Services, a big hit in the short term, but replaceable.

Trump is going Protectionist, others are not and our future lies with others.

Trump will not be President forever, we can afford to wait.

The emerging economies are the ones we want, benefits to both sides.

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

Surely everyone who voted Brexit knew that.

It's difficult to understand how the economy will thrive if people stop spending money while they wait for the right goods to be in the shops.

Chicken washed in Chlorine? Fish full of plastic? Seems a good time to become a vegetarian.

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

I'm afraid that, in their eagerness to convince us that the sky will fall down, they are not listening to you.

If we should end up having a trade agreement with the US, it doesn't mean that everyone here will buy chlorinated chicken. Some will prefer to buy chicken from other sources, including our own, even if they cost more; others will opt for something else such as New Zealand lamb.

I also believe that, despite all their threats and bluster, the EU will be forced to agree a trade deal with us after Brexit. The German car manufacturers and the French wine and cheese makers will see to that or they will lose a market beneficial to them.

Japanese cars are very good - expect to see more of them on our streets. South African and Australian wines are very good - expect to drink more of them. Even the self opinionated EU mandarins will realise that.

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

You don't seem to understand how the economy works JBR. There will always be a demand for french wine. It's the best. (although I prefer a nice Rioja, that's in the same predicament). The problem is that it will push what we currently buy off the shelf into a luxury good. So we will just be worse off as individual consumers.

In terms of being "forced" into a deal, it doesn't work like that. The market will adjust, but car makers can't justify a reduced margin to suit our political whims. German cars will just become more expensive. So we will end up with sheet cars which we can afford or the cars we see as within our reach now as beyond our means. This is what happens when your economy is not as strong.

I think you're living in a dream world if you think we will be able to have the same buying power. It's only going to happen with a really long transition period. Something I'm in favour of but brexit voters are totally against.

Don't over-estimate the power of the UK as a market place. Consumer demand is starting to wane. This is not just down to brexit. Brexit has coincided with changes in buy to let which will definitely impact on the economy. You may not notice changes in your neck of the woods but the grass is starting to grow between paving stones in cities, homeowners are downsizing, houses are being let to goodness knows who, there is a crime wave, safety standards are failing (note the number of fires and just yesterday some people died in a rented property from monoxide poison, Deutsche is restructuring, many banks are going to Frankfurt.

Like I said you don't notice in your little world, but I'm seeing changes. Cannabis smoke wafts down the street now, no police to stop it. Before it was all professionals and now it's goodness knows how living here. Dream on with your sky falling down jokes. It already has in some places.

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

Hi

Not everything is as simple as some think.

The EU are not blustering, the UK is.

It is our Government which is shouting no deal is better than a bad deal,not the EU.

A threat we simply cannot carry out, hence us going begging for an extension for 20 months.

The EU is a much bigger economy than the UK, so any Trade Deal will be driven by them, that is how these things work the World over.

Of course we will get a Trade Deal with the EU, it will cover manufactured goods and agricultural products, that suits both of us.

They will hammer us on Services, our biggest export.

The issue is not the EU, but the 40 odd Countries we already have Trade Deals with as part of the EU.

Japan and South Korea are two of the very big economies involved.

We need to sort all these out before we do anything else.

As regards wine, Chilean wine is already Tariff Free as part of a Trade we have as part of the EU.

The WTO Duty on wine is £27.90 per 100 litres, or 133 bottles.

Hardly likely to cause problems for the French or Spanish.

As regards cars, under WTO Rules there is a Most Favoured Nation Status Rule.

If we allow Japanese and Korean Cars in Tariff Free, we will have to allow German and French Cars in Tariff Free as well.

Hence the need for Free Trade Deals to avoid WTO Rules.

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

But I thought we don't want WTO? I'm confused. How will we be able to take advantage of any of these conditions without trade deals which will take years to negotiate? Which we would not need to bother with had we not decided to leave the EU. So how are we better off Swim?

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

There you go again blaming all our woes on Brexit.

Grass in between paving slabs and Police numbers are a product of Gov't austerity measures . Nothing to do with Brexit.

Banks are NOT going to Frankfurt they are opening small offices there in order to circumvent the protectionist policies of the EU.

The pre -eminence of London as a financial and services superpower can not be replicated over night elsewhere nor will it be.

Buy to let dominance in the housing market is a result of mass immigration and a lack of investment in social housing by UK Gov'ts over the past 30 years.

As for the cannabis smoke.......you should try some and chill out!.....but the reality is that due to mass immigration and the lack of opportunity that creates for British people, we have a generation and an underclass of poorly trained, badly prepared and low paid workers that smoke more weed as an escape from their drudgery.....

That's life in the EU for you!

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

You won't know if you're buying it or not when the US make stopping labelling food with country of origin a condition of a deal. It will also find it's way into processed food, stock cubes, soups , sauces etc , be served in restaurants and take aways. Even if you stopped eating chicken altogether, there would be a lowering of standards in other areas to get a US trade deal.

The safest way will be to buy only foods from the EU, where higher standards are maintained, it may cost more, but worth it. Will that be New Zealand lamb killed by Halal slaughter? Almost all of it is.

Re: Not going well for Trade deals.

Hi

A couple of things.

We are losing Passporting for services, we diverging from the Regulatory Standards of the EU, our choice, not the EU.

It is true that very few staff are being transferred.

That is not the issue,it is the fact the trades will be registered in the EU, so they get the Tax on them, not the UK.

This tax loss will be significant.

The City of London will remain one of the biggest Financial Centres in the world just that the Government will not have as much money to spend.

As for New Zealand Lamb, yes it is Halal, but it is stunned before slaughter,which is different to many places here in the UK.