Join for free
Page 7 of 7 « First < 5 6 7
JBR's Avatar
JBR
Chatterbox
JBR is offline
Cheshire, UK
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 32,785
JBR is male  JBR has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 07:51 PM
61

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

A comment by a doctor, found on Facebook, with which I completely agree:

"So far I've been quiet over the tragic case of Alfie Evans, but as a doctor, a father of four and a former intensive care doctor I feel I have a duty to speak.

"Firstly, no child is the property of their parents. As parents our own anguish, emotion and needs are entirely and utterly secondary to the best interests of our children. We do not own them. We can't make demands on what happens to them like a piece of furniture. Furthermore, as parents we are naturally conflicted in deciding what is best for them in times of dire crisis. Because of the unconditional love we have for our children we will naturally cling to hope even where there is none. Despite being a doctor I find it impossible to objectively medically assess my own children, because I'm their Daddy, not their doctor.

"Secondly, doctors and nurses act in the best interests of their patients - not the parents, not the press, not some feral "army," not politicians, not the Pope, the PATIENT. The first line of the modern Hippocratic Oath is "Make the care of your patient your first concern." The staff at Alder Hey were working under incredibly difficult conditions even before a mob started accusing them of murder. Now their job is impossible.

"Thirdly, Alfie Evans has an irreversible, catastrophic degenerative neurological disorder with no hope of recovery. The brain does not regenerate. Respiratory function and other basic physiological reflexes are literally, neurologically nothing whatsoever to do with sentience, consciousness or self awareness. Death, surrounded by those who love Alfie, peacefully, quietly, in dignity is in his best interests, this has been affirmed not just by his doctors but by the highest Court in the land. Having pictures of him in intensive care plastered all over the press, or being used as a political and religious football, or having people scream outside his hospital room is NOT in his best interests.

"Finally, the behaviour of "Alfie's Army" is, to be frank, disgusting. Threatening doctors and nurses by name such that they fear for their lives is disgusting. Threatening to storm a children's hospital is disgusting. Threatening to pull fire alarms when other children are on the operating table having life saving surgery is worse than disgusting. Piggy-backing onto the grief of the parents of a baby you have never even met is flagrant grief tourism and an ultimate act of selfishness. Furthermore, veiling such aggressive and malignant behaviour behind a pretense of faith could not be further from what it means to be a Christian.

"If you believe there is a conspiracy among the medical profession, or a cover up, or you believe parents own their children, or that the parents' feelings are more important than the dignity of their child, or if you are a member of Alfie's army then please do me a favour and remove yourself from my friends list.

"God Bless you, Alfie."
ruthio
Chatterbox
ruthio is offline
Southern UK
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 11,732
ruthio is female  ruthio has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 07:57 PM
62

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

Well thank goodness for this doctor!

Thanks for that link JBR, I wish his wise words were plastered all over every newspaper tomorrow!
JBR's Avatar
JBR
Chatterbox
JBR is offline
Cheshire, UK
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 32,785
JBR is male  JBR has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 08:07 PM
63

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

Originally Posted by ruthio ->
Well thank goodness for this doctor!

Thanks for that link JBR, I wish his wise words were plastered all over every newspaper tomorrow!
Yes. I can understand the parents' feelings, but what annoys me is the army of people who like to jump on the bandwagon and feel that they are fighting for a good cause.

In reality, I believe they are nothing more than hedonists. I'd compare them to the crowds who surrounded that hospital where the latest royal sprog was born the other day.
Judd's Avatar
Judd
Chatterbox
Judd is offline
West Riding of Yorkshire
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 12,538
Judd is male  Judd has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 08:16 PM
64

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

A superb assessment by the doc that sums up the situation perfectly. It should be printed in all newspapers so that on the off-chance some of the rent-a-mob can read they may feel shame at their actions and learn from them.
Pesta's Avatar
Pesta
Chatterbox
Pesta is offline
North of the South UK
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 6,337
Pesta is female  Pesta has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 08:36 PM
65

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

Originally Posted by ruthio ->
Well thank goodness for this doctor!

Thanks for that link JBR, I wish his wise words were plastered all over every newspaper tomorrow!

Originally Posted by Judd ->
A superb assessment by the doc that sums up the situation perfectly. It should be printed in all newspapers so that on the off-chance some of the rent-a-mob can read they may feel shame at their actions and learn from them.

Could't agree more ruthio and Judd.
Thanks for posting that JB. What a wonderful post from that doctor.
Morticia's Avatar
Morticia
Chatterbox
Morticia is offline
England
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 13,924
Morticia is female  Morticia has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 09:16 PM
66

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
My emotions stem from the medics "owning" you once you become too weak to fight your corner. This happened to OH where he was a prisoner in a MH unit. It was an awful place and there was no way for me to move him to a better facility once he was in there. They forced him to have ECT against his will and I could do nothing to stop it. This happens to people every day and the system stops you from doing anything.

Most people don't think about it because the system does not become apparent until you end up lost in it when something awful happens. People do not plan for such catastrophes.
Now I understand why you feel as you do. Sounds like you've had a bad, and painful experience which fortunately I haven't had.
My story is the opposite.
My mum was diagnosed with terminal cancer on New Years Eve 1999, so we brought her home. She refused treatment and wanted nature to takes it course. Her decision to refuse treatment and we , none of us, tried to talk her out of it and just took each day as it came of the estimated 3 to 6 months left to live.
After 8 months, the breakthrough pain became chronic pain and she seriously declined and we hit the intravenous morphine stage with variable levels of lucidity. She'd had oral thrush, shingles and finally developed a chest infection. She was growing weaker unable to battle too much.

Our GP took me and my sister aside and asked us what we wanted to do. At the time that threw me a bit as I'd expected her to tell us what she was going to do. Instead she explained that mum could be given antibiotics to try to deal with the infection ... or instead withhold them and increase her morphine levels.

It was clear what she was saying, or it seemed so to me and my sister. After a weighted silence we asked her not to treat the chest infection. Did she agree with this? She said in her opinion, given mum's outlook ... yes.
Mum passed away a couple of days later.
I had the good fortune to have an understanding GP who thought of all of us. To this day I'm not sure where the GP, or any of us, stood legally on that but in my heart I still thank her even though I felt I'd colluded at passing a death sentence.
AnnieS's Avatar
AnnieS
Chatterbox
AnnieS is offline
United Kingdom
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 18,420
AnnieS is female  AnnieS has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 09:42 PM
67

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

Something similar happened with my father Morti but it wasn't discussed, just obvious that his body couldn't handle the medication they injected into him. He died within fifteen mins. But that's also in the 90s. These days there is a fear of litigation.

I recently had a chat with a district nurse who said that they spend more time filling in reports than they do with a patient because of fear of legal action and having to keep good records as evidence to take care of their own back should anything go wrong.

I'm sure there are plenty of pontificating medics out there who all have strong opinions on this case which they can beautifully articulate to persuade those on their side of the social sphere, but IMO that doesn't change the fact that the balance of power is all wrong. The lower you are on the social scale, the less chance you have of any say in your treatment or that of loved ones. OH was lucky because I was there arguing with his multi disciplinary team or whatever they called themselves. He would never have got out if I hadn't persuaded them to change tactics. I felt like I'd landed in "one flew over the cuckoo's nest" and couldn't believe that patients have so little power over their fate once they have been deemed to lose capacity.
Morticia's Avatar
Morticia
Chatterbox
Morticia is offline
England
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 13,924
Morticia is female  Morticia has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 10:05 PM
68

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

It's time me and thee had a girly hug

And if anyone comes in and makes a crash or crude comment I'll kick their shins.
AnnieS's Avatar
AnnieS
Chatterbox
AnnieS is offline
United Kingdom
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 18,420
AnnieS is female  AnnieS has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
29-04-2018, 11:28 PM
69

Re: The Alfie Evans case has proven we have to change the law in favour of parents

Aww thank you!
 
Page 7 of 7 « First < 5 6 7

Thread Tools


© Copyright 2009, Over50sForum   Contact Us | Over 50s Forum! | Archive | Privacy Statement | Terms of Use | Top

Powered by vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.