16-07-2018, 11:52 AM
91
Re: Brexit and the EU
Originally Posted by JBR
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The difference is that we continue to pay for our 'membership' of the EU and, in being a member, are subject to all of their political rules and regulations. They effectively dictate to us how we must live and what we may and may not do. That is a great deal more than trade regulations.I am not averse to trading with the EU after we have left, but their threats seem to revolve around our not being allowed to do so unless we agree to remain, at least partly, under the thumb.
Does the EU dictate to China and India how they should run their own countries?
This goes back to the original organisation, the EEC, which was then purely a free-trade organisation. I'd have no objection to our being a part of that. However, it has now grown into effectively a political dictatorship and, worse, its members are obliged to pay handsomely for the Commission to dictate what they must do.
Another difference is that China and India (and everyone else) are free to make their own trade agreements outside of the EU.
We are not.
If the EU would treat us like China and India (and others) I see no reason why we should not trade with the EU as an outsider, but do you really think they'd happily allow us to do that, when they know that other members of their 'club' might then decide to do the same.
No. They want to punish us!
Absolute bollox.
The EU have offered a straight Free Trade Deal.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ns-CETA-Canada
It is exactly the same as they deal with other Countries on and a standard WTO Trade Deal.
We have turned it down.
No need to pay them a penny, no more Free Movement, acceptable to Canada, Japan and South Korea and others.
Why are we so special?
Take it and leave and get on with life outside and making similar Trade Deals with everyone else.
16-07-2018, 12:20 PM
92
Re: Brexit and the EU
Originally Posted by Bruce
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I put this message in another thread just started but perhaps it is more suitable here. (too many Brexit threads for sanity)I was somewhat surprised to read the headline on the ABC News website this morning:
Theresa May warns there could be 'no Brexit at all',
British Prime Minister Theresa May has warned there may be "no Brexit at all" because of continued attempts to undermine her plan to leave the European Union.
"My message to the country this weekend is simple: we need to keep our eyes on the prize," Ms May wrote in the Mail on Sunday newspaper.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-07-1...at-all/9996052
This can't be possible surely?
Her true colours seem to be emerging, as so many of us suspected all along.
16-07-2018, 12:24 PM
93
Re: Brexit and the EU
Originally Posted by swimfeeders
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HiAbsolute bollox.
The EU have offered a straight Free Trade Deal.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...ns-CETA-Canada
It is exactly the same as they deal with other Countries on and a standard WTO Trade Deal.
We have turned it down.
No need to pay them a penny, no more Free Movement, acceptable to Canada, Japan and South Korea and others.
Why are we so special?
Take it and leave and get on with life outside and making similar Trade Deals with everyone else.
and then the EU refuses her kind offers.
Incidentally, why do you keep assuring me that whatever I write is 'complete bollocks'?
Perhaps a more polite form of wording might encourage a more productive discussion. Or perhaps it's just the way you speak to people.
16-07-2018, 12:56 PM
94
Re: Brexit and the EU
Originally Posted by JBR
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If that is the case, why does May continue to push for our giving more and more to the EU which you claim they don't want?...and then the EU refuses her kind offers.
Incidentally, why do you keep assuring me that whatever I write is 'complete bollocks'?
Perhaps a more polite form of wording might encourage a more productive discussion. Or perhaps it's just the way you speak to people.
Quite simple, I respond in kind, something I have learnt to do on this Forum.
Rational discussion and facts have gone out of the window.
As this example, the EU have offered us a straight free Trade Deal, it has been widely reported, yet you still trot out the view that they are trying to punish us.
The EU has rules for membership, we left, we want to be out of the Single Market and Customs Union, to be free to go our own way.
We have rejected the EU Rules, our choice.
We have ruled out a Swiss Type deal, so there is only one alternative, a standard WTO Trade Deal.
The rest of the World trades quite happily with this type of deal, why cannot we?
If we had accepted this immediately after the Referendum and given ourselves two full years to get ready to trade under the new system we would not be in the position of having to go begging and paying a mint for a transition Period.
16-07-2018, 01:09 PM
95
Re: Brexit and the EU
Whilst I refuse to sink to your level, and accuse you of talking bollocks, I shall explain why we do not want a 'Swiss deal'."From the perspective of the EU, the treaties largely contain the same content as the EEA treaties, making Switzerland a virtual member of the EEA. Most EU law applies universally throughout the EU, the EEA and Switzerland, providing most of the conditions of the free movement of people, goods, services and capital that apply to full member states. Switzerland pays into the EU budget and extended the bilateral treaties to the new EU member states, just like full members did, although each extension requires the approval of Swiss voters in a referendum."
and
"On 22 December 2016, Switzerland and the EU concluded an agreement whereby a new Swiss law (in response to the referendum) would require Swiss employers to take on any job seekers (whether Swiss nationals or non-Swiss citizens registered in Swiss job agencies) whilst continuing to observe the free movement of EU citizens into Switzerland thus allowing them to work there."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Switze...nion_relations
In short, Switzerland still pays into the EU and is obliged to permit free movement of EU citizens into their country.
Is that not dissimilar to remaining in the EU in many respects? Certainly not what I (and 17.4 million others) voted for.
16-07-2018, 02:06 PM
97
Re: Brexit and the EU
That goes for the rest of the planet too. WTO is suitable only for the most primitive economies. Everyone else has trade deals and has to suck it up if they don't have a strong bargaining position.What aces do you think we hold in our hand to make us a special case? Because I think with Brexit we are flushing our strong points down the loo.
16-07-2018, 02:09 PM
98
Re: Brexit and the EU
By the way according to reports the US are threatening Equador with sanctions if they implement a UN breast feeding directive to encourage mothers to breast feed. This is at the behest of milk formula manufacturers. That's the sort of future bx we face going it alone.16-07-2018, 02:36 PM
100
Re: Brexit and the EU
Originally Posted by AnnieS
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That goes for the rest of the planet too. WTO is suitable only for the most primitive economies. Everyone else has trade deals and has to suck it up if they don't have a strong bargaining position.What aces do you think we hold in our hand to make us a special case? Because I think with Brexit we are flushing our strong points down the loo.
Even Germany, although in the EU, will certainly still be eager to sell us their cars. They are aware that there will be competition from Japan and the far east.
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