Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

Hi

I have made my views perfectly clear about Ireland in a thread that I started.

My view is simply that we say no to the EU demands, we are a sovereign state and we make our own Border Arrangements, nothing to do with the EU.

The fact remains that much of this information as you call it is not coming from the EU, it is coming from our traditional allies outside the EU who we have upset with our arrogant incompetence in dealing with them and trying to impose changes to existing Trade Deals on them which they find unacceptable.

This has resulted in complaints being made to the WTO.

These actions are entirely our own, nothing to do with the EU.

There have been statements made by the Governments concerned, not EU disinformation.

You may find this level of incompetence acceptable, I do not.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

I think it is true to say that few countries outside Europe particularly care one way or another whether Britain stays in the EU or not; as you say it is a decision for Britain. What has shocked outsiders is the total lack of preparedness for the negotiations and the apparent lack of understanding about how to approach the negotiations.

Certainly Australia has no strong feelings about Brexit in general. Our negotiations with the EU over a free trade agreement had stalled (we upset Italy by banning their canned tomatoes from entering the country) and I think an EU without Britain is of less interest to us as a trading nation. However our government is far more concerned about getting something from the wreckage of the TPP (Trans Pacific Partnership) than to worry about a trade agreement with any European nation at the moment.

For us Brexit really is just a spectator sport where the ongoing action rather than the outcome is interesting and newsworthy but eventually when you want a trade deal we are ready and we are experts at it.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

This is interesting, a German MP saying that BREXIT is the fault of Brussels he says the British joined the EU expecting one thing and got another. He says imagine this you join a football team expecting to play football then the management announce they are playing golf, that's the situation the Brits are in.... How true! He goes on to say how BREXIT will impact on the EU.... Worth a read.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/88...el-Germany-MEP

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

Of course Brussels are to blame for their intransigence before the referendum. I hope this will force them to change.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

I wasn't referring to any country other than the EU who have a vested interest in giving us a rough ride. Neither was my post addressed particularly to you but a statement to of my general opinion of the trend of the thread to concentrate on the negatives.

Whatever the UKs relations are with the WTO, if indeed it is as you say, none of it has any bearing on the way the EU is behaving toward the UK.

Are you saying that that you believe every claim the EU makes about the negotiations? Are you saying that they are acting in an entirely fair and honest manner? So far they seem to have taken everything the UK has offered and pocketed it with nothing in return.

One of the main reasons for leaving the EU was to get away from the stifling regulatory regime and decide our own destiny. For me that hasn't changed and if there is a price I will pay it willingly and so I believe will the others who voted to leave. Everything the EU has done since we gave notice, has just made me even more convinced it is right.

None of us have any idea what has been said in the talks since the only information we receive is second and third hand via news media who these days seem to bend the truth with monotonous regularity.

What truly disappoints me is that most people only seem to see the drawback and totally ignore the opportunities.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

Hi

Of course I am not happy with the way the EU are handling the exit negotiations.

The Irish Border is absolutely nothing to do with the EU, it is a matter solely between the Irish and the UK.

As regards the amount of money they are demanding, we pay solely what we are legally obliged to do.

If there is any dispute between our lawyers and their lawyers then it goes to International Arbitration, settled by a third party, which is how things are done.

As regards EU Citizens here in the UK, we offer them the same rights as EU Citizen's have in France.

That gets the objections out of the way, if they turn down these reasonable offers, the we leave, with a great big barrier between Northern Ireland and the South and the end of free movement for the Irish to the UK.

We would also apply tariffs to all Irish Goods travelling through the UK, even if the ultimate destination is the EU.

This is perfectly legal and would force them to greatly increase their costs by having to go the long way round by sea.

That is what I meant by playing Hardball.

Next, the Transition Period.

May sent the letter, we are leaving in March 2019. fair enough.

Our Government then asked for a 2 year Transition deal.

The EU said fine, you can have one, but it will cost you.

That is not bullying, that is business. anybody would have done the same.

We started Article 50 negotiations with our red lines, we are leaving the single market and the customs union.

Full stop, finito, we are not going to be negotiating that.

The EU have said, fine, your decision, the best you can get on that basis is what we have just negotiated with Canada.

We said that is not fair, we want more.

The response from the EU has been ,well, it was your choice, it does not suit us to give you any more.

Our rallying cry, oft repeated, by May and our Government, is no deal is better than a bad deal.

The EU has responded to that ultimatum by fine, we are quite happy with no deal, it suits us.

That is not bullying, it is good business on their part.

They have done their sums.

The EU have not been obstructive at all on splitting up the other Trade Deals we have with Non EU Countries as part of the EU.

We split the tariff and Non Tariff Quotas up and the EU agreed with our proposals.

Instead of negotiating these with the Countries affected, Liam Fox went straight to the WTO to register them.

Some of the Countries have objected, risking these trade Deals which are two way, they are a benefit to the UK.

I am seriously unhappy with the way things are going with the 3 EU Demands, however our own Prime Minister agreed to sorting these out before talks moved on to any trade deal.

We are where we are, however much of it is entirely down to our own stupidity.

I am still convinced that leaving the EU is the correct thing to do.

I am not however convinced that our Politicians are making a good job of it.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

I live in Greece, my impression is that there is turmoil going on in the UK, I believe that almost no politician believed that Britain would leave the EU, hence all the muddle.
Only history will be able to say whether or not it was preferable that Britain left the EU or not. The only certain thing is that the British people's pockets are going to be hard hit for the immediate future.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

I think you should try and rein in your EU Good/ UK Bad narrative.

You seem to think everything the EU does, their every strategy, tactic and action is super clever and super valid.

Why don't you criticise the EU for not entering in to these negotiations in good faith and for not treating an ally and current member with respect.

Why are you not outraged?

Are you the sort who blames the victim for the crime?

The UK took a democratic and legal decision to Leave the EU and you promulgate and support the EU's insidious efforts to derail that decision..

Also, Liam Fox can't be negotiating trade deals at the moment because, too our detriment, the UK has always followed EU rules and under 'The Rules' we're not supposed to.

There is practically no gain in slagging off the British negotiators and very little in slagging off the UK Gov't.

The clock is ticking and it's a nuclear clock so it will never stop ticking so we just have to back our negotiators and call out the EU, The Irish Gov't .

The truth is that there is a lot more going on behind the scenes than any of us do or need to know.

My guess is that we will soon reach an agreement on the finances probably by way of a lump sum and spreading payments over the next 10 years. Then the trade negotiations will be ramped up.

It actually disgusts me that so many Brits have turned on their own country simply because they don't have what it takes to hold their nerve. I'm glad this is 2017 and not 1939!

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

Perhaps you should point the finger of accusation at yourself Moscow.

Re: Brexit a view from abroad.

Unfortunately it won't be just the immediate future Sue unless they get their fingers out and find a more sensible solution than the piffle we have seen thus far.