04-03-2015, 06:21 PM
101
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by sparrowbjn
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In Denmark we do not understand why there isnīt a statute of limitation on these cases.
and
I havenīt met one single person in Denmark who believe that Cliff has done anything wrong!
Just how many persons have you spoken to on the subject and did they give you permission to speak on their behalf?
04-03-2015, 06:39 PM
102
Re: Cliff Richard
I donīt know whether Cliff is guilty or not but I do know that he was interested in sex at one time. Ask Jet Harris. Jet Harris divorced his first wife because he found her in bed with Cliff. This was of course many years ago but I keep reading that Cliff was not interested in sex, well maybe he isnīt now but he certainly was then. How do I know? Well the woman concerned lives not far from me and we know her quite well, she has never said anything unpleasant about any of the people she then mixed with but she has told us many stories of the things that used to go on. Of course people change over the years but past deeds are still past deeds and the ones that happen to be crimes should be investigated. However I think they should be investigated without the media being allowed to print "suspicions", facts only or nothing at all.04-03-2015, 06:44 PM
103
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by clumsy
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I donīt know whether Cliff is guilty or not but I do know that he was interested in sex at one time. Ask Jet Harris. Jet Harris divorced his first wife because he found her in bed with Cliff. This was of course many years ago but I keep reading that Cliff was not interested in sex, well maybe he isnīt now but he certainly was then. How do I know? Well the woman concerned lives not far from me and we know her quite well, she has never said anything unpleasant about any of the people she then mixed with but she has told us many stories of the things that used to go on. Of course people change over the years but past deeds are still past deeds and the ones that happen to be crimes should be investigated. However I think they should be investigated without the media being allowed to print "suspicions", facts only or nothing at all.
04-03-2015, 06:45 PM
104
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by sparrowbjn
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Thanks for your warm welcome!!Oh, you are so funny. Hillarious!!....lol - true - I bet there will come a total of 12 or more alleged victims - it was the same with the rest I mentioned - I guess you will have to include their names in my new company name!! The same applies for them. One thing I cannot understand - there are celebrities I find rather repulsive, creepy etc - and if they were accused of a sex crime I would notice it - but some people - not anyone of you rest assured of that - but on the Internet reach some kind of satisfaction within the feeling of glee - or "I told you so"...I would not bother to do that - it is equally disgusting as supporting the wrong "party". Why? Well, I wish I were a Psychologist.
Go after a man if he is alive - once you are dead you are dead - unless you can defend yourself from the grave - and you cannot do that. Still, nice to know that there is money in his estate. I only know Saville from TOTP.
However, if it was a murder then you have to investigate it - even if the person is dead, but then you do have some kind of EVIDENCE to support your case.
I am disgusted at how the whold business with Yewtree have become judgemental above all - all the names I mentioned above were being called all kinds of names - and not many spoke up for them. Donīt the UK believe in innonce until proven guilty - it was as if they should prove that the didnīt do it. You CANNOT do that after 30 years. Well, Cliff might be able to since Billy Grahamīs security people made sure that Cliff and the rest were safe in one place (he was scared of women accusing him of rape, true!!)...maybe a bit of paranoia - and curiosity would be the solution
Think how the Queen must have felt when she heard about Rolf Harris. No doubt they would have engaged in even small talk and she honoured him to paint her picture.
Innocent until proven guilty, but we can't preach innocence in such a sensitive subject such as this. A fan club is not what is required here. Facts are.
04-03-2015, 06:50 PM
105
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by Myra
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Sparrow, I can see you are obviously a huge Cliff fan. Fair enough. My friend is also. However, you can't really preach too much as we don't really know the outcome of all of this. I'm not that interested in Cliff. If he's innocent, then i'm glad he will be proved so. I'd hate to think of someone being made to feel guilty if it isn't so. But - and this is a huge but - I'm more interested in anyone who has been the victim of abuse. They are paramount compared to anyone or any so called celebrity.Think how the Queen must have felt when she heard about Rolf Harris. No doubt they would have engaged in even small talk and she honoured him to paint her picture.
Innocent until proven guilty, but we can't preach innocence in such a sensitive subject such as this. A fan club is not what is required here. Facts are.
Good post .....
04-03-2015, 06:52 PM
106
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by Victors Mate
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Agree with that 'tis what I would like to see happen however the Police must be allowed to ask through the Press for other victims to come forward especially those whose allegations were not believed at the time.
04-03-2015, 06:59 PM
107
Re: Cliff Richard
I resent it when you write that I have it all sewn up, because I donīt - in fact I started by saying - as what is common in Denmark - that once a person is dead he is dead - so unless it is a murder investigation - the truth dies with him...and then I sort of acknowledge the importance (In the UK) to get to the bottom of the Saville case (because he is from the UK). I have noticed that once the likes of Paul, Jim, Michael etc were arrested a lot of trolls etc started with the "glee" thing and ""I told you so" - He is like Saville. I never spoke about the victim, but strange thing is that once you are falsely accused - you suddenly become the victim - have you seen the movie called "The Hunt"...he was falsely accused - and that stigma would never leave him - he ended up getting shut at - though he did not die - and then the viewer have to wonder who did that...yes, his very best friend whose small child accused his friend of molesting her (falsely). The same thing happend to a Dane in the US..it was living hell. He was aquitted too, but the media in the US had almost passed the death sentence on him. True.But I still think that a lot of people took pleasure in the hurt of some celebrities. I think that some people find pleasure in other people being hurt - I am not talking about abuse victims - but it is rather odd to wait 30 years. I hope new generations teach their kids to talk to their parents about abuse.
Sorry if I offended you with my stance on things. I donīt see "glee" in the hurt of abuse victims - but in (some) human being. Have a nice evening
04-03-2015, 07:05 PM
108
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by Patsy
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So true - heard the tragic story from a man a couple of days ago, who was horrifically abused at a children's home, only when it came up on the news, did he feel able to come forward knowing someone else had taken that 'giant step' .....
Yes, the giant step that victims decide to take and it doesn't always end positively. Why are some people so disbelieving? A great friend of mines was raped by her brother on numerous occasions. She was pregnant at 16 by him and went on to have a miscarriage. The hospital staff called her "a dirty girl". She didn't have the confidence or courage to tell anyone what had happened. Many years on she had a nervous breakdown. When she told anyone in her family what had happened , they refused to believe her. The ostrich syndrome yet again. Her brother is now dead, but she still suffers at the hands of him, mentally, all these years on. So as I've said, it's the victims I have an interest in.
04-03-2015, 07:11 PM
109
Re: Cliff Richard
Originally Posted by Myra
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[/B]Yes, the giant step that victims decide to take and it doesn't always end positively. Why are some people so disbelieving? A great friend of mines was raped by her brother on numerous occasions. She was pregnant at 16 by him and went on to have a miscarriage. The hospital staff called her "a dirty girl". She didn't have the confidence or courage to tell anyone what had happened. Many years on she had a nervous breakdown. When she told anyone in her family what had happened , they refused to believe her. The ostrich syndrome yet again. Her brother is now dead, but she still suffers at the hands of him, mentally, all these years on. So as I've said, it's the victims I have an interest in.
It truly sickens me ....
04-03-2015, 07:17 PM
110
Re: Cliff Richard
We CAN preach innocent until proven guilty ESP on a matter like this. Are you in favour of miscarriage of justice? I am not, because that is what might happen if we even hint at a person being guilty when he or she has NOT been charged, NOT arrested - not even been in court. Not even a verdict. But I see that we have to compare to Rolf again, but he WAS guily, so that is only fair that he gets a sentence.Would you have liked it to happen to the people I mentioned before who were innocent, but most people probably said that since it was a delicate matter, they might be guilty. No, no - it is innocent until proven guilty. At least in Denmark. I will never understand how people can jump on the bandwagon and suggest that we have to consider they are guilty, because we do not. I would NOT like to be accused of a crime I did not commit.
Teachers are being falsely accused all of the time - I used to know a PE teacher who was falsely accused and there were the snide comments that he was probably guilty - it turned out he was innocent too. She had made it all up
Odd thing is in Denmark we still listen to Gary Glitter, Jonathan King and Phil Spector. The latter was convicted of murder, but that i because it is the art form we are listening to. I know someone would be offended, but I love music.
I love gossip and find it amusing that people believe that Barbados does not have extradition treaty with the UK!! The UK and Barbados have bilateral extration treaty with the UK because it is part of the Commonwealth. Cliff was seen in November with a red passport (UK passport) - if he was a Barbados citizen it would have been blue. He resides in Barbados. Maybe he can apply for dual citizenship. He had better sit tight and I hope he has a memory that goes back 30 years. It is awful to think about it - but a lot of witnesses who can tell us where Cliff was at this and time might be dead - but then again that might be the whole idea. I rest my case.
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