Re: A Cheer For Boris!

They might try.

Gibraltar, as anyone who has sailed into the Med knows, is a massive influence on all shipping in and out of the Med.

Half a dozen subs, plus the aircraft runway, could stop all, except friendly, movement.

I doubt that the UK will back down easily, but the EU might be persuasive, this time, over Spain.

Or negotiations might start all over?

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

Spain have been given a veto over the deal by the commission, however I don't think the commission would allow the "tail to wag the dog" so to speak so it will be interesting to see what happens there.

Saying that, in the broad scheme of things, Boris Johnson looks like the strongest leader out of the 28 now in my view.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

Annie,

Anyone with any "dealing" experience would know that you get a better deal by holding out against a bad deal.

The earlier suggested deals (looking back into all those years of negotiations), were just cannon fodder, designed to keep us in.

Once we got the right negotiaters involved, things changed.

Only when leaving without a deal became a real prospect, did the EU back down.

So what should we have done?

Capitulated?

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

He says, ignoring the caveat of the EU's demands at the time of the poll.
You know; like the "significant divergences on level playing field, governance, and fisheries" that were mainly resolved to the UK's benefit to get the deal done.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

Speaking for myself I don't have a problem with that, because it is entirely reasonable.
What is not reasonable however is deliberately ignoring pertinent facts and/or deliberate misinterpretation in order to try and prove the remainer bias is justified.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

In the eyes of many opposed to Brexit?
Yes of course.
Such objectors will never be happy and would, I'm certain, continue to complain most viciferously no matter what the outcome.

It's time for those opposed to Brexit to accept their loss and move on.
Life is too short to waste it grumbling about pie-in-the-sky dreams.
Now is the time to start making the most of new opportunities.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

I'm not sure how much of a liar he is. However, I am one of those who still believes we would have been better off completely out of the EU with no deal. I have always said that.

I agree. I have neither the time nor the knowledge to read through the deal in detail. However, you are perfectly correct that the EU never wanted us (their cash cow and rubbish depository) to leave, and for that reason I wouldn't trust them an inch.

Yes. Thankfully, we have a group who are able to pick out any traps that the EU may have set for us.

Going back to my original comment above, I'd be interested to learn whether losing our control of our territorial waters - and remaining tied to the EU in other ways which have been suggested (eg, Northern Ireland) - is really worth a free trade deal with the EU, bearing in mind that they sell far more to us than we to them. And that's coming from someone who would benefit from a FTA if I go ahead and buy a new VW Golf in March!

Thankfully, though, we shall have left the EU at the end of the year, which is the main thing.
Whether we live with their 'deal' or decide in the future that it is not worth it, we should never hand our country over to a foreign power ever again.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

First we haven't lost control.
They are our waters - but yes the EU will continue to fish them for some years ahead.
Given that we don't currently have a fishing fleet capable of taking advantage were we to deny access I don't necessarily see that as a negative, especially when we now have an opportunity to rebuild a sizeable fishing fleet if our industry thinks it viable.

Second ..... personally I will wait to see the various feedback that I'm pretty sure will come, not only from the ECG & Farage but from elsewhere too before forming a more firm opinion.

Regarding Ireland though I have to say that I thought the UK played an absolute blinder; there is enough leeway for the UK to continue pretty much as normal but with a few minor changes.
NI needn't be considered any more different than, say, Jersey IMHO albeit obviously larger, plus it seems to have avoided the obvious potential pitfall.

Is it perfect?
Probably not.
If however the UK is indeed again an independent nation, then that is an excellent outcome.
Those who said Boris (and the EU) couldn't agree in such a short time have been proven very wrong.

The country is too fractured for everybody to be even remotely happy, but as long as the majority are content then we have a firm base to move forwards from.
This deal, if it is as promised, will provide that firm base.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

Nicely put Zaphod

Bruce, we actually left the EU at the end of last year. What has been happening since then has, euphemistically, been called "the transition period" while a trade deal was thrashed out. This was explained ad infinitum to Solasch on this very forum.

Re: A Cheer For Boris!

I shall wait for the end of the year, and possibly even later than that, to find out what all the fine details are.

If we have achieved all that we want and need, then that's fine.

Call me a cynic, but I have not made up my mind yet.