02-12-2020, 08:06 PM
82
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by weedeek
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Four points:- you’re talking hypothetically
- a rant is not an argument
- no point trying to debate with someone with extreme views who won’t listen.
- can’t make up my mind if you’re for real or just like to stir things up
See ya
#2 certainly not a rant and there is no argument. Just focus on facts.
#3 Far from extreme.
#4 what you see is what I believe. No "wind up" involved.
02-12-2020, 08:27 PM
83
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by weedeek
->
Four points:- you’re talking hypothetically
- a rant is not an argument
- no point trying to debate with someone with extreme views who won’t listen.
- can’t make up my mind if you’re for real or just like to stir things up
See ya
I have been pleasantly surprised to see the level of support here from sensible, logical, normally quiet Scots who - like me - do not want to see yet another bladdy referendum and do not want to see an independent Scotland under the SNP.
Not that this matters much because Sturgeon is ripping the SNP apart with her obvious hatred causing splits in her party!
Originally Posted by scot37
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gaun yersel weedeek 
For the non-Scots here that roughly translates to:
Keep quiet unless you contribute to the thread.
02-12-2020, 08:56 PM
84
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Looking at this in The Times, Scotland is moving towards a split in the SNP which will certainly see any move towards another referendum falter and fall by the wayside for now at least.
"Nicola Sturgeon faces SNP revolt after critics seize control of the NEC" is the headline.
Then follows details of how rebels and allies of Alex Salmond are taking over key SNP posts.
' Those who support the leadership were despondent. “The SNP is now a left party with all the splits and nonsense that entails,” one said. “The NEC is a f***ing zoo.” '
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...-nec-jblb7xpwb
Don't blame me if you are not able to read The Times; it has a free trial period if you really don't want to pay read.
Or you can read a brief summary here:
http://action4equalityscotland.blogs...nfighting.html
02-12-2020, 08:59 PM
85
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by weedeek
->
Folks getting a bit worked up re Scotland here. Calm down. If Scotland chooses the path of self determination, then it would be up to the people of an independent Scotland to debate whether to apply for EU membership, and a heated debate it may be. Similarly, it would be up to the Scottish people to choose which party they prefer in the general election that would follow independence. No need for you to worry about things you won’t be involved in.
The SNP might not like it, but the UK is a single sovereign nation and has been for over 300 years.
Over that time, people from both countries have lived together and worked together and, importantly, intermarried. Don't they have a say?
Personally, I have no Scottish blood in my veins, though I have Scottish relatives through marriage to my wife. My preference would be for Scotland and England to remain united as one nation. The progress we have made over those 300 years has been made largely through our unity.
For that reason, I believe that Scotland should not be allowed to make the choice of leaving the Union alone. The decision should be made by all members of the UK.
02-12-2020, 11:45 PM
86
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by JBR
->
Don't you think the English should also have a say in whether or not they want their nation to be broken up?The SNP might not like it, but the UK is a single sovereign nation and has been for over 300 years.
Over that time, people from both countries have lived together and worked together and, importantly, intermarried. Don't they have a say?
Personally, I have no Scottish blood in my veins, though I have Scottish relatives through marriage to my wife. My preference would be for Scotland and England to remain united as one nation. The progress we have made over those 300 years has been made largely through our unity.
For that reason, I believe that Scotland should not be allowed to make the choice of leaving the Union alone. The decision should be made by all members of the UK.
03-12-2020, 12:15 AM
87
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by JBR
->
Don't you think the English should also have a say in whether or not they want their nation to be broken up?The SNP might not like it, but the UK is a single sovereign nation and has been for over 300 years.
Over that time, people from both countries have lived together and worked together and, importantly, intermarried. Don't they have a say?
Personally, I have no Scottish blood in my veins, though I have Scottish relatives through marriage to my wife. My preference would be for Scotland and England to remain united as one nation. The progress we have made over those 300 years has been made largely through our unity.
For that reason, I believe that Scotland should not be allowed to make the choice of leaving the Union alone. The decision should be made by all members of the UK.
You still don't get it at all do you?
Notice you didn't think it should be a matter for Wales and Northern Ireland just argued the case for the English.
I guess your imagined British empire is actually an English empire?
Do you think the whole of the EU should have voted on Brexit?? Thought not.
Have another Duff and keep up the good work!
03-12-2020, 01:21 AM
88
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by weedeek
->
You’ll notice I said “IF the Scottish people...”, it’s by no means certain. Personally I believe Scotland is big enough , rich enough and smart enough to become an independent nation and would vote yes. There are those who see the truth in that but , despite this, think Scotland is better of in the Union. That is a fair enough argument although I would argue against it. The ones who really annoy me are those who argue that Scotland is not capable of governing itself which is an insult tbh. However, the unionists and establishment hold all the economic cards here. Polls are all well and good (56% in favour today) but it’s another story when those not totally convinced are standing in the polling booth with pencil in hand and ponder all the scare stories we are already being bombarded with . The current shenanigans within the SNP NEC won’t help. All in all, I fear you’re going to have to put up with us for some time yet. Will be delighted to be proved wrong of course. This is maybe not what you expected me to say but there you go.
"I believe that Scotland should not be allowed to make the choice of leaving the Union alone. The decision should be made by all members of the UK."
Although it has been claimed that most of the English would be glad to see the back of Scotland, I still hope that that is not the case and that the majority of English feel, like I do, that we are better off together. I know that my Scottish friends here in England would certainly want that to continue.
I agree with you that, hopefully, we'll have to put up with you for some time yet!
03-12-2020, 08:28 AM
89
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
Originally Posted by JBR
->
I assume that you read my final point:"I believe that Scotland should not be allowed to make the choice of leaving the Union alone. The decision should be made by all members of the UK."
Although it has been claimed that most of the English would be glad to see the back of Scotland, I still hope that that is not the case and that the majority of English feel, like I do, that we are better off together. I know that my Scottish friends here in England would certainly want that to continue.
I agree with you that, hopefully, we'll have to put up with you for some time yet!
03-12-2020, 09:51 AM
90
Re: U n b e l i e v a b l e !!
@weedeek:Those "scare stories" you say you are being bombarded with are not really scare stories when there is no answer to them.
As in what currency an independent Scotland would use, and as in how an independent Scotland could balance the books given the dire state of its finances.
If Sturgeon or the SNP were serious about independence they must realise that such things need to be not only aranged but proven to be viable before asking folk if they want independence; bodging a plan afterwards is no solution and sensible people know that.
You would think that after 2014 the SNP would know that.
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