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Bread
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16-08-2019, 09:28 AM
41

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by gascony ->
Reply to the (ironically named?) Realist.
Your post demonstrates your anger, for sure, but also how poor your judgement has become. There is no dictatorship. There no usurping of democracy. You have got yourself confused in your passion. The efforts are to prevent a no deal exit. And remember, no one voted for a no deal exit. To impose a no deal exit, when that is not what was voted for in 2016, that would be a travesty of democracy. Focus on that, please.
Let me explain with an example. Say a room full of people were asked whether they wanted sandwiches or salad for lunch. Everyone has to have the same. Out of 100 people, 52 say they’d prefer sandwiches. So everyone is now expecting to get sandwiches for lunch. The 48 are not happy and do complain. But they have to accept that its sandwiches for lunch – besides, the 52 point out, some of the sandwiches might have bits of salad in them. So stop moaning. Then, just before lunch, it’s announced by 2 of the 52 that in fact sandwiches are not possible. Instead the only choice possible for lunch is bits of bread. And the 98 should not complain because we voted for a bread based lunch and that’s what we’re going to get. The 48 are very angry now. The want to stop lunch completely and go back to getting a salad. They point out that the vote was between sandwiches, no doubt with lovely fillings, or salad. Compared to bits of bread they are beginning to think that sandwiches might be ok, but salad would still be better. No, no, no say the 2 who announced the bits of bread lunch, we all voted and the majority clearly voted for a bread based lunch and that’s what we are getting. Strangely now, quite a lot of the other 50 who voted for sandwiches are now convinced that they voted for just bread. They are angry with those who are trying to stop them getting bread for lunch. Strange, because they actually voted for sandwiches. That’s you, that is.


17.4 million people voted to leave the EU - with or without a deal.

498 MPs voted to trigger A50 - to leave with or without a deal

Majority in Parliament voted in favour of the withdrawal bill - to leave with or without a deal.

No deal is better than a bad deal was repeated over and over in the election by the Tories and Farage.

Conservative and Labour manifestos state they will respect the decision of the people.

What on earth are you talking about when we said we did not vote to leave with "no deal" ???

Second part - how to you remove Juncker or Tusk ? You can't - they are appointed and cannot be deselected. If you want dictatorship look no further than the EU.
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16-08-2019, 09:39 AM
42

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by Bread ->
17.4 million people voted to leave the EU - with or without a deal.

498 MPs voted to trigger A50 - to leave with or without a deal

Majority in Parliament voted in favour of the withdrawal bill - to leave with or without a deal.

No deal is better than a bad deal was repeated over and over in the election by the Tories and Farage.

Conservative and Labour manifestos state they will respect the decision of the people.

What on earth are you talking about when we said we did not vote to leave with "no deal" ???

Second part - how to you remove Juncker or Tusk ? You can't - they are appointed and cannot be deselected. If you want dictatorship look no further than the EU.
You are getting as pink faced as Realist. The 2016 leave campaign, the 17m voted you refer to, was explicit in avoiding any dialogue about the possibility of a no deal exit. It was clearly not a vote winner so the focus was on how easy it would be to get a great deal. That was the basis of the leave vote. Please do not try to re-write events to suit your current narrative.
(And please do not distract by introducing notions about how the chair of the council is voted for. Not a dictatorship.)
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16-08-2019, 10:21 AM
43

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by gascony ->
You are getting as pink faced as Realist. The 2016 leave campaign, the 17m voted you refer to, was explicit in avoiding any dialogue about the possibility of a no deal exit. It was clearly not a vote winner so the focus was on how easy it would be to get a great deal. That was the basis of the leave vote. Please do not try to re-write events to suit your current narrative.
(And please do not distract by introducing notions about how the chair of the council is voted for. Not a dictatorship.)
Not true - "no deal is better than a bad deal" was a common theme across the referendum on the leave side. Even Phillip Hammond said in 2016 during the referendum that a WTO exit was "an honest model to follow".

We voted to leave the EU - leave the ECJ, customs union, single market etc - nowhere on the ballot or the leaflet from the government did it mention any deal.

Your revising history.

Your "Dear Leader" was the only guy on the ballot - a secret ballot so nobody knows who actually voted for him anyway. Hardly democratic is it, then the new Dear Leader wasn't even on the ballot, she was chosen because Merkel didn't like Timmermans. Again - where's the democracy ?

You can't get rid of your unelected leaders, you're living a lie if you think your single party leadership is democratic.

P.S. look at what is happening with Corbyns power grab as a unity government in the event of a no-deal Brexit. The Lib Dems won't support it (the biggest remain party) because even they would rather have a no-deal Brexit than Jeremy Corbyn.
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16-08-2019, 10:38 AM
44

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Blah blah blah.
There was no vote for leaving without a deal.
You've clearly convinced yourself that it did happen. So I suggest you sit in a quiet place with own happy thoughts.
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16-08-2019, 10:46 AM
45

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by gascony ->
Blah blah blah.
There was no vote for leaving without a deal.
You've clearly convinced yourself that it did happen. So I suggest you sit in a quiet place with own happy thoughts.
17.4 million people voted to leave the EU with or without a deal. There was no deal on offer at the time of the referendum - we cannot vote for something that does not exist.

I'm loving it in my happy corner.....
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16-08-2019, 10:53 AM
46

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

There was no vote for leaving without a deal.

There is a lot of talk about the leavers not having voted to leave with a no deal. However, at the risk of being lambasted, I wonder how many of those who, like me, voted to leave, irrespective of a deal? Let's just get out!
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16-08-2019, 11:00 AM
47

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Here we are again with the Remainer Drivel.
I was quite aware when I voted leave that it might lead to No Deal, as I think were most Leavers

Funny how the only people who don't seem to be aware of that are the Remainers.
Leavers take the view that while a Deal would have been preferable, they are quite willing to Leave with No Deal

Or to put it another way, as we were told by the Prime Minister at the time - "No Deal is better than a bad deal"

This was also explained by Cameron, Osborne, Hammond, and others

See 'Hammond Himself Said Voting Leave Could Lead to No Deal'

www.order-order.com 14 Aug 2019 10 - 10 am
itsme
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16-08-2019, 11:02 AM
48

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by Bread ->
17.4 million people voted to leave the EU with or without a deal. There was no deal on offer at the time of the referendum - we cannot vote for something that does not exist.

I'm loving it in my happy corner.....

There was no vote to leave without a deal, end of story.
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Bread
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16-08-2019, 11:07 AM
49

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by itsme ->
There was no vote to leave without a deal, end of story.
There was no deal to vote for in the first place. Like I said - it didn't exist
gascony
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16-08-2019, 11:22 AM
50

Re: no deal actually means lots of deals

Originally Posted by Bread ->
There was no deal to vote for in the first place. Like I said - it didn't exist
Twisty words. The leave campaign avoided talk of no deal. They specifically focused on an easy deal (and other stuff, just not no deal outcome). They knew, I knew, you knew that if they explained no deal then it would be a vote to remain by a sizable margin. Imagine taking the 'factories shutting, farms closing' message to the people for a vote... leave campaign would have sunk without trace. Gove, Johnson, Farage repeatedly claimed 'great deal will be easy'. Have you forgotten what you voted for?
 
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