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Banchory
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11-04-2021, 07:40 PM
61

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Our exports are 40% down due to businesses being closed during the pandemic. The same will go for the rest of the world.


Stop making things up. Your looking at January's figures when the UK was locked down. Germany and France are still in lockdown and will be most likely to the end of the year.
Most manufacturing did not close during the pandemic and neither did financial services. Some of the slowdown is undoubtably due to the pandemic but commerce has continued, just less so in the high street. Also if it was due to the pandemic we would be seeing similar falls in other countries export figures but it seems that is not happening so Brexit looks the be the main reason for the collapse of our exports to the EU
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11-04-2021, 08:33 PM
62

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
Most manufacturing did not close during the pandemic and neither did financial services. Some of the slowdown is undoubtably due to the pandemic but commerce has continued, just less so in the high street. Also if it was due to the pandemic we would be seeing similar falls in other countries export figures but it seems that is not happening so Brexit looks the be the main reason for the collapse of our exports to the EU

Supply chains were shut down all over the world causing chaos in manufacturing. The high Street relies on goods being delivered for them to sell so do the on line retailers. The high Street is not all bakers and greengrocers.

Furloughing was rife in the private sector which is responsible for manufacturing, goods etc. Stockpiling has also been responsible for the shortfall of exports from the UK and the diversion of goods to the domestic market instead of overseas.

Other countries lock downs were not the same as the UK - the EU had curfews like in France etc

Project fear is not coming true it has been debunked over and over again
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11-04-2021, 08:47 PM
63

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Other countries lock downs were not the same as the UK - the EU had curfews like in France etc

Project fear is not coming true it has been debunked over and over again
Our cinemas, restaurants and pubs were closed. By nine o'clock everybody was at home. Still, exports were hardly influenced by that.

But now you mention it. France had 5.1 mln covid cases, 98,750 dead. The UK had 4.4 mln cases and 127.083 dead. Indeed there are differences in handling covid and different lockdowns. Yours causes more deaths. Not a reason to boast.
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11-04-2021, 09:14 PM
64

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Project fear is not coming true it has been debunked over and over again

According to bloomberg Britain is further below pre-pandemic levels than any other G-7 economy. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ct-fear-warned

In April 2016, the government sent a leaflet to all U.K. households, urging them to vote in favor of staying in the EU. It warned that leaving would increase the cost of living, because a falling pound would make imports more expensive. (About half of all U.K. imports come from the EU.)
That prediction turned out to be prescient. The pound fell by as much as 18% against the euro within two years of the referendum, and remains 12% below its level on the day of the Brexit vote.

Project fear is not debunked, but to be fair, like swimfeeders stated on several occasions,the full cost of Britain’s decision to sever ties with its biggest and nearest commercial partner is likely to only become clear once the coronavirus restrictions ease and businesses return to normal. The debate is still far from settled.
Banchory
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11-04-2021, 09:40 PM
65

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Supply chains were shut down all over the world causing chaos in manufacturing. The high Street relies on goods being delivered for them to sell so do the on line retailers. The high Street is not all bakers and greengrocers.

Furloughing was rife in the private sector which is responsible for manufacturing, goods etc. Stockpiling has also been responsible for the shortfall of exports from the UK and the diversion of goods to the domestic market instead of overseas.

Other countries lock downs were not the same as the UK - the EU had curfews like in France etc

Project fear is not coming true it has been debunked over and over again
Non essential shops in high streets were closed during lock downs however the could operate click and collect and trade online. My wife’s business had no problem with orders and deliveries of manufactured product all through the pandemic. The only delivery issue she had was Brexit related in early January this year.

Manufacturing was exempt from lockdowns

https://www.pinsentmasons.com/out-la...virus-lockdown

You seem to be paranoid about “project fear” an invention of Brexiteers.

Since we left at the end of last year the UK has stumbled from one Brexit derived disaster to another eithout even a glimmer of the mythical “sunlit uplands”
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11-04-2021, 10:34 PM
66

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
Non essential shops in high streets were closed during lock downs however the could operate click and collect and trade online. My wife’s business had no problem with orders and deliveries of manufactured product all through the pandemic. The only delivery issue she had was Brexit related in early January this year.

Manufacturing was exempt from lockdowns

https://www.pinsentmasons.com/out-la...virus-lockdown

You seem to be paranoid about “project fear” an invention of Brexiteers.

Since we left at the end of last year the UK has stumbled from one Brexit derived disaster to another eithout even a glimmer of the mythical “sunlit uplands”

Your playing with words again. Just because manufacturing was exempt it didn't mean the industry wasn't furloughed and carried on as normal despite the pandemic and brexit was to blame for trade reductions.

The government has been lobbied over and over again to extend furloughing to protect manufacturing industries from mass unemployment.
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11-04-2021, 11:06 PM
67

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
The government has been lobbied over and over again to extend furloughing to protect manufacturing industries from mass unemployment.
Sounds familiar?

Brexit and coronavirus are two shocks that are almost perfectly designed to substantially
affect the entire UK economy. Brexit has and will continue to affect most of those sectors
that rely on cross-border trade with the EU. Meanwhile, coronavirus has most affected
non-tradeable services – those that rely on face-to-face contact. This means that few
sectors escape unscathed: we estimate that 69% of the economy is badly affected by
at least one of coronavirus and Brexit.
Banchory
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12-04-2021, 06:30 AM
68

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Your playing with words again. Just because manufacturing was exempt it didn't mean the industry wasn't furloughed and carried on as normal despite the pandemic and brexit was to blame for trade reductions.

The government has been lobbied over and over again to extend furloughing to protect manufacturing industries from mass unemployment.
No, I am saying that the loss of friction free trade with the EU due to Brexit which came into being as of 1st January has had a significant impact on our export market, a doubly whammy on top of the pandemic that many companies will not survive.

The lobbying was principally by the automotive and aerospace industries which have reduced output during the pandemic

However, the ONS data indicates only 9% of the UK’s manufacturing sector were furloughed, which is below the economy-wide average of 13.2%
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12-04-2021, 08:52 AM
69

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
No, I am saying that the loss of friction free trade with the EU due to Brexit which came into being as of 1st January has had a significant impact on our export market, a doubly whammy on top of the pandemic that many companies will not survive.

The lobbying was principally by the automotive and aerospace industries which have reduced output during the pandemic

However, the ONS data indicates only 9% of the UK’s manufacturing sector were furloughed, which is below the economy-wide average of 13.2%
The friction on trade is a breach of WTO rules by the EU. These are pedantic, childish measures that are not necessary. Thankfully, the EU have now seen sense and are no longer frustrating borders.

To think that overnight, the 27 members states decided no longer to buy goods from the UK because of Brexit is nonesense. There may have been a delay in goods going to the EU for a number of reasons including.

1. UK manufacturers not producing goods due to the pandemic, furloughing staff and transport issues due to COVID-19 and infections.

2. Stockpiling on the EU side due to Brexit (unnecessarily as it turned out)

3. Broken supply chains - take the Suez Canal that got blocked - there has been a big dip in trade because parts and components were stuck in the Suez Canal (PS5 stock for example).
Banchory
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12-04-2021, 06:05 PM
70

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
The friction on trade is a breach of WTO rules by the EU. These are pedantic, childish measures that are not necessary. Thankfully, the EU have now seen sense and are no longer frustrating borders.

To think that overnight, the 27 members states decided no longer to buy goods from the UK because of Brexit is nonesense. There may have been a delay in goods going to the EU for a number of reasons including.

1. UK manufacturers not producing goods due to the pandemic, furloughing staff and transport issues due to COVID-19 and infections.

2. Stockpiling on the EU side due to Brexit (unnecessarily as it turned out)

3. Broken supply chains - take the Suez Canal that got blocked - there has been a big dip in trade because parts and components were stuck in the Suez Canal (PS5 stock for example).

There was no friction on trade by the EU only the friction introduced by leaving the single market and customs Union which is totally down to Brexit.

In case you hadn’t noticed, we are not trading with the EU on WTO rules, we are trading under the terms of the trade agreement we have negotiated. So what Breach of WTO rules?

Many small EU companies who make low value sales direct to the U.K. have decided that they didn’t want to register for UK VAT and act as collection agents so have ceased trading with the U.K.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and-...mers-in-the-uk

There are companies who undertake JIT manufacturing sourcing elsewhere.

First you state the that UK manufacturers were not producing goods
Then you say the EU were stockpiling goods we didn’t produce?

Have you used the same logic as the case for Brexit?

Please enlighten me as to how the blockage of the Suez Canal which, incidentally happened on 23rd March, disrupted trade between the EU and the U.K. in January and February?
 
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