01-07-2021, 09:15 PM
41
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by Tedc
->
It seems clear that the Criminals have the most powerful support.Public resistance to recoding videos, which could secure conviction (and help with other normal facts of life - like observing someone falling over in the street).
Public resistance, also, to the penalties, for those convicted, to be severe enough to discourage doing it again.
The Legal Professionals who are heavily trained to fight off any sort of accusation, often without it ever getting to court, or to reduce the penalty if convicted. Nice money, if you can get it.
(I've suggested, before, that it ought to be criminal to represent someone who you know to have "done the job" & get the crim released!)
Most of our heat seems aimed at the Police.
Obviously they have enough people, enough technology & enough training?
I'm surprised that there is any enthusiasm left in our police!
It's a one sided game - we know that - but we let it happen! do we have enough skills to catch, document, & take on the lawyers?
Secondly we don't have room or money to imprison offenders.
The rest of it is window dressing.
To say that invasive technology is going to fix that is myopic to the zenith. Why should the rest of us be punished with mass surveillance?
01-07-2021, 09:32 PM
42
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by AnnieS
->
Yes that's because it's due to lack of police on the beat and lack of investigators and proper decisions on where funding should go (e.g not to a Maddie zillion ££s investigation which still hasn't been properly solved) Secondly we don't have room or money to imprison offenders.
The rest of it is window dressing.
To say that invasive technology is going to fix that is myopic to the zenith. Why should the rest of us be punished with mass surveillance?
01-07-2021, 09:45 PM
43
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by Tedc
->
It seems clear that the Criminals have the most powerful support.Public resistance to recoding videos, which could secure conviction (and help with other normal facts of life - like observing someone falling over in the street).
Public resistance, also, to the penalties, for those convicted, to be severe enough to discourage doing it again.
The Legal Professionals who are heavily trained to fight off any sort of accusation, often without it ever getting to court, or to reduce the penalty if convicted. Nice money, if you can get it.
(I've suggested, before, that it ought to be criminal to represent someone who you know to have "done the job" & get the crim released!)
Most of our heat seems aimed at the Police.
Obviously they have enough people, enough technology & enough training?
I'm surprised that there is any enthusiasm left in our police!
It's a one sided game - we know that - but we let it happen! do we have enough skills to catch, document, & take on the lawyers?
Public resistance to recoding videos
(I assume you meant 'recording' videos.)
Do you have any evidence to support the assertion that the majority of the public disapprove of recording of video evidence which could secure conviction of criminals?
I certainly support it.
Public resistance, also, to the penalties, for those convicted
Surely, it can't be true that the majority of law abiding people disagree that penalties for criminal acts need to be more severe. I believe that they should be and I'm sure most others do.
The Legal Professionals who are heavily trained to fight off any sort of accusation
A difficult one. Defence lawyers have a right to defend their clients and, I assume, to go so far as lying in order to do so! Surely, if they are shown to have lied in order to defend a person who is then proved to be guilty of a crime, that lawyer should be tried for attempting to prevent the court concluding the veracity of guilt and should be punished accordingly?
Most of our heat seems aimed at the Police
Ah, yes. Without doubt, I think the police must now be lacking in enthusiasm, bearing in mind the apparent problems we put in their way. I know I would be.
We should certainly increase their numbers and also offer them as much support in as many ways as we can unless there is evidence and proof beyond any doubt as to their failing in their duties. Anything else would be grossly unfair to them and counter productive for us all.
01-07-2021, 10:00 PM
44
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by JBR
->
Taking each of the above in turn:Public resistance to recoding videos
(I assume you meant 'recording' videos.)
Do you have any evidence to support the assertion that the majority of the public disapprove of recording of video evidence which could secure conviction of criminals?
I certainly support it.
Public resistance, also, to the penalties, for those convicted
Surely, it can't be true that the majority of law abiding people disagree that penalties for criminal acts need to be more severe. I believe that they should be and I'm sure most others do.
The Legal Professionals who are heavily trained to fight off any sort of accusation
A difficult one. Defence lawyers have a right to defend their clients and, I assume, to go so far as lying in order to do so! Surely, if they are shown to have lied in order to defend a person who is then proved to be guilty of a crime, that lawyer should be tried for attempting to prevent the court concluding the veracity of guilt and should be punished accordingly?
Most of our heat seems aimed at the Police
Ah, yes. Without doubt, I think the police must now be lacking in enthusiasm, bearing in mind the apparent problems we put in their way. I know I would be.
We should certainly increase their numbers and also offer them as much support in as many ways as we can unless there is evidence and proof beyond any doubt as to their failing in their duties. Anything else would be grossly unfair to them and counter productive for us all.
On a more subtle level rather than the police having to justify their actions, especially the ridiculous situation where police having to report themselves to the police complaints authority in the event of a serious incident leave that to the person who feels aggrieved and with NO legal Aid and no "no win - no fee" rubbish.
02-07-2021, 08:57 PM
45
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by JBR
->
Taking each of the above in turn:Public resistance to recoding videos
(I assume you meant 'recording' videos.)
Do you have any evidence to support the assertion that the majority of the public disapprove of recording of video evidence which could secure conviction of criminals?
I certainly support it.
Public resistance, also, to the penalties, for those convicted
Surely, it can't be true that the majority of law abiding people disagree that penalties for criminal acts need to be more severe. I believe that they should be and I'm sure most others do.
The Legal Professionals who are heavily trained to fight off any sort of accusation
A difficult one. Defence lawyers have a right to defend their clients and, I assume, to go so far as lying in order to do so! Surely, if they are shown to have lied in order to defend a person who is then proved to be guilty of a crime, that lawyer should be tried for attempting to prevent the court concluding the veracity of guilt and should be punished accordingly?
Most of our heat seems aimed at the Police
Ah, yes. Without doubt, I think the police must now be lacking in enthusiasm, bearing in mind the apparent problems we put in their way. I know I would be.
We should certainly increase their numbers and also offer them as much support in as many ways as we can unless there is evidence and proof beyond any doubt as to their failing in their duties. Anything else would be grossly unfair to them and counter productive for us all.
I don't get the bit where you use the term "the Majority" - I didn't use it!
What I started with was "It seems clear", which, to me, means "it seems clear to me".
The rest of it I stand by.
02-07-2021, 09:05 PM
46
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by Tedc
->
(I've suggested, before, that it ought to be criminal to represent someone who you know to have "done the job" & get the crim released!)02-07-2021, 11:52 PM
47
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by The Artful Todger
->
It's not being punished. It's being protected. Relying on the inherent goodness of people is a farce. There is none. Certainly not in the case of the overwhelming number of FILTH that are now well established in this country and it is infecting the younger indigenous British people.
03-07-2021, 11:01 AM
48
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by Tedc
->
Thanks for the spelling correction, JBR.I don't get the bit where you use the term "the Majority" - I didn't use it!
What I started with was "It seems clear", which, to me, means "it seems clear to me".
The rest of it I stand by.
I'd be very surprised if the majority of the public didn't support recording of criminal activity. It stands to reason after all.
03-07-2021, 11:04 AM
50
Re: Watching Rome Burn
Originally Posted by annies
->
how is it being protected? It's the law abiding majority that are being punished with what is effectively existence in an open prison whilst anyone who is actually breaking the law remains outside this system. Even if caught they are not even reprimanded. Nuts!
Yes. As I've said before, crime pays in broken Britain.
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