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30-09-2020, 09:37 PM
61

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by The Artful Todger ->
But this awful vucking firus is debating in a chaotic and at times random manner that means that protective and social protective measures must react to events! Policy has to change quite literally "on the fly" to try to match.

What can't be accurately predicted can not be managed with a fixed program.
That's simply not true. While the virus is spreading now, that should not have stopped the Government from coming up with policy over the summer as to what they will do when there is a second wave and agreeing it in Parliament. They did nothing because this is how they approach everything. Months of relaxation and then sudden panic mode when things come to a head. There's absolutely no excuse for not having debated these law changes in the past months. It's simply poor management of the country.
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30-09-2020, 09:38 PM
62

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by Donkeyman ->
And we are also in england Annie! You should be used to it
by now,you have had more than forty years of this??

Donkeyman! 😟😟
What do you think Thatcher would have done?
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01-10-2020, 10:41 AM
63

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Brady's 'win' shows Tory woe over Covid powers

Mark D'Arcy
Parliamentary correspondent

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54347957

Wednesday's vote is on a motion that the temporary powers in the Coronavirus Act "should not yet expire."

That is the wording specified in the act - framed as a straight yes or no question - which means that Mr Speaker may not think it proper to allow an amendment to be put - and even if he did, and it passed, it is not clear that any amendment would carry legal force.

Nearly everyone in Parliament accepts that at the start of the pandemic, the government had to move fast to implement the lockdown and the measures around it - and some of the legislative weapons involved were inevitably rather blunt.

But Parliament has now been back for several months, and the sight of major restrictions on civil liberties, backed up by swinging fines, being signed into law by ministers in regulations - know as statutory instruments (SIs) - now grates on MPs across the parties.

In normal times, all kinds of regulations go through Parliament almost unnoticed, and usually with little more than perfunctory rubber-stamping.

Some can be "prayed against" - requiring them to be debated before they can take effect - others (called Made Affirmative Statutory Instruments) come into effect immediately, but do have to be debated after the event, usually within 28-40 sitting days.

According to the parliamentary think tank, the Hansard Society, 247 Coronavirus-related SIs have been laid before Parliament, 60 of them made affirmatives.

The list of SIs includes local lockdowns, mask-wearing regulations, extension of pre-trial custody, denial of prison visits, travel regulations, listing and de-listing exempt countries, and of course the fines for transgressors

So these are not trivial matters.

Now Graham Brady, the chairman of the Conservatives' backbench 1922 Committee has demonstrated that he has the numbers to defeat the government if it carries on pushing through pandemic measures which restrict civil liberties, without consulting Parliament first.
BJ's run as "fascist dictator" may soon be coming to an end, then .....
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01-10-2020, 05:43 PM
64

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
That's simply not true. While the virus is spreading now, that should not have stopped the Government from coming up with policy over the summer as to what they will do when there is a second wave and agreeing it in Parliament. They did nothing because this is how they approach everything. Months of relaxation and then sudden panic mode when things come to a head. There's absolutely no excuse for not having debated these law changes in the past months. It's simply poor management of the country.
Actually the government did have pre-existing plans in place. You've obviously forgotten the times when contents of convid meetings were leaked to the media and the media immediately jumped on the sections where it mentioned 'worst case scenario' and went hand and fist in reporting that the government was going to do this that and the other when things got way too bad and of course, opposition MP's jumped on the information saying the government was planning to make draconian laws on how the public went about their lives in the presence of the virus.

Yes the government did plan ahead, way ahead and they planned for ALL scenarios from the good to the very bad but of course, there is always some turd who feels it's their responsibility to leak the information to the press.

Then we get people like yourself saying the government didn't plan. Yes they did plan but turd's in government kept leaking it to the media who then always twisted the information to suit a different narrative.
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01-10-2020, 06:07 PM
65

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
That's simply not true. While the virus is spreading now, that should not have stopped the Government from coming up with policy over the summer as to what they will do when there is a second wave and agreeing it in Parliament. They did nothing because this is how they approach everything. Months of relaxation and then sudden panic mode when things come to a head. There's absolutely no excuse for not having debated these law changes in the past months. It's simply poor management of the country.
But it IS true. With a chaotic unpredictable virus and an uncooperative unpredictable element in the population all that can be done is being done and it has to be largely reactive.
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01-10-2020, 08:25 PM
66

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by Dodge ->
Actually the government did have pre-existing plans in place. You've obviously forgotten the times when contents of convid meetings were leaked to the media and the media immediately jumped on the sections where it mentioned 'worst case scenario' and went hand and fist in reporting that the government was going to do this that and the other when things got way too bad and of course, opposition MP's jumped on the information saying the government was planning to make draconian laws on how the public went about their lives in the presence of the virus.

Yes the government did plan ahead, way ahead and they planned for ALL scenarios from the good to the very bad but of course, there is always some turd who feels it's their responsibility to leak the information to the press.

Then we get people like yourself saying the government didn't plan. Yes they did plan but turd's in government kept leaking it to the media who then always twisted the information to suit a different narrative.
Leaks shmeeks. The facts speak for themselves.

A situation where you have various agencies being taken by surprise by government decisions which have been announced on TV is NOT proper planning. If you are under the impression that they had good planning then think again. Good planning includes stakeholder consultation. They had plenty of time to get everyone on board and adjust according to local feedback. It's half baked.
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01-10-2020, 08:26 PM
67

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by The Artful Todger ->
But it IS true. With a chaotic unpredictable virus and an uncooperative unpredictable element in the population all that can be done is being done and it has to be largely reactive.
"All that can be done" gives them a lot of room for incompetence.
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02-10-2020, 10:30 AM
68

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
Leaks shmeeks. The facts speak for themselves.

A situation where you have various agencies being taken by surprise by government decisions which have been announced on TV is NOT proper planning. If you are under the impression that they had good planning then think again. Good planning includes stakeholder consultation. They had plenty of time to get everyone on board and adjust according to local feedback. It's half baked.
There has NOT been plenty nor time to wait for local feedback nor a need to get everyone on board. This is a frigging WAR ffs.
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02-10-2020, 10:35 AM
69

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
"All that can be done" gives them a lot of room for incompetence.
..... and so it has proved - incompetence begets shambles begets debacle begets chaos .....
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02-10-2020, 11:21 AM
70

Re: Parliament - Speaker -'Total disregard for this Chamber is not acceptable'

Originally Posted by Omah ->
..... and so it has proved - incompetence begets shambles begets debacle begets chaos .....
So what do YOU think should be done taking all of the unknown and unpredictable factors into account?
 
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