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OldGreyFox
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OldGreyFox is offline
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11-10-2020, 12:08 PM
21

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by Morticia ->
The trouble with not overwhelming the hospital system is, people are waiting for surgery, others are waiting for early cancer diagnosis or cancer treatment .... others are trying to help the system in their own way by not going to their local GP ... and so there's a massive traffic jam forming.
All to protect the NHS from been overwhelmed.

It makes you wonder how things would have unfolded if, instead of propping up workers to the tune of billions of pounds that money had, instead, been pumped into expanding medical facilities to ensure they could cope better.
There is little support available for the individual who finds they have caught the virus, with the general advice been to stay at home and only seek medical aid if you can't cope.

It's not really comparable with the 1918 influenza pandemic for a few very pertinent reasons.
Over 50 million people died, ... and there was only 1.8 billion souls on the planet then. A third of the worlds population, 500 million, became infected with it . 1% to 3% of the worlds population died.

Whereas now ... just over a million have died, out of a world population of nearly 8 billion. Very small in comparison.

This is nothing compared to 1918 .... except then ordinary people weren't jetting around the world on holidays and casually spreading germs.
And in 1918 the medical profession was in it's infancy compared to todays advances and developments.
Doesn't seem to have done us much good does it.


I doubt an orderly staged transfer to herd immunity is going to be a viable option.
I imagine at some point it will be more like getting shoved out of a plane and hoping your parachute inflates before you hit the ground.

A jolly soul aren't I.
About once a week someone comes out with a statement that I concur with, and really wish I'd have written that....

Congratulations Morty, this week it's you....
And further to your comment about 1918....Some of the world's population were lying dead in the mud over in France...So I would think that in the absence of the NHS, the medical profession would have been a little 'Stretched' to say the least..

This virus is perhaps a symptom of the way we live these days, overcrowded cities, and overseas travel, are all adding to the severity and rapid spread of Covid.
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11-10-2020, 12:26 PM
22

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by OldGreyFox ->
Didn't some government advisor or official, forecast back in April that this virus is so virulent that their could be half a million deaths in the UK by September, with people dying in the streets...
Not that I can link to but, at that time, the death rate was the worst in Europe, with over 1,200 people a day dying in the UK from COV-ID (recorded figures only) , so an extrapolation to at least 200,000 deaths would have seemed reasonable at the time (500,000 seems excessive). As we know, deaths from COVID-19 have been reduced to 80 a day (but increasing) in the UK

However, back in April, daily new cases in the UK were running at a (then) record of 5,500 and lockdown was in full force - the infection rate dropped and most people were led to believe that the virus was under control but it's back with a vengeance - a (new) record of 17,540 new cases per day (08/10) and a 7-day average of 13,000+ (recorded figures), 20,000+ (ONS Survey estimate) - no-one "extrapolated" that in April ..... but "extrapolating" from it, when the government seems to have lost control, does lead to some alarming figures .....

So, it seems, deaths and infections are, to a greater or lesser extent, "known" but "long covid" is, to all intents and purposes, an "unknown", at least until the "second wave" is over and "results" can be collated and compiled .....
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11-10-2020, 12:41 PM
23

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by Omah ->
Not that I can link to but, at that time, the death rate was the worst in Europe, with over 1,200 people a day dying in the UK from COV-ID (recorded figures only) , so an extrapolation to at least 200,000 deaths would have seemed reasonable at the time (500,000 seems excessive).

However, back in April, daily new cases in the UK were running at a (then) record of 5,500 and lockdown was in full force - the infection rate dropped and most people were led to believe that the virus was under control but it's back with a vengeance - a (new) record of 17,540 new cases per day (08/10) and a 7-day average of 13,000+ (recorded figures), 20,000+ (ONS Survey estimate) - no-one "extrapolated" that in April ..... but "extrapolating" from it, when the government seems to have lost control, does lead to some alarming figures .....
I think while ever we are trying to contain the virus we are just postponing the inevitable Omah. I'm a big believer in protecting the vulnerable but allowing the virus to burn itself out in the community. I believe that's how viruses usually come to end. When it runs out of infectable people and thereby preventing the links.

It's like dowsing a bushfire while ever there is still flammable material left to reignite. Most of the moors and forestry where I walk have firebreaks to prevent out of control fires. The young people could be allowed to be our covid firebreak Omah, and the economy need not suffer any more, otherwise we might be better off letting the virus take us.
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11-10-2020, 12:55 PM
24

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by OldGreyFox ->
I think while ever we are trying to contain the virus we are just postponing the inevitable Omah. I'm a big believer in protecting the vulnerable but allowing the virus to burn itself out in the community. I believe that's how viruses usually come to end. When it runs out of infectable people and thereby preventing the links.

It's like dowsing a bushfire while ever there is still flammable material left to reignite. Most of the moors and forestry where I walk have firebreaks to prevent out of control fires. The young people could be allowed to be our covid firebreak Omah, and the economy need not suffer any more, otherwise we might be better off letting the virus take us.
You are, of course, entitled to that viewpoint but it is one that I consider to be blinkered and, coincidentally, one that Donald Trump seems to endorse by inviting 2,000 people to gather, unmasked and undistanced, on the grounds of the (already infected) White House .....

So, far, 37 White House staff and other contacts have tested positive, 11 of them being connected to the Amy Coney Barrett nomination event on Sept. 26 in the Rose Garden, White House, from which many attendees flew home to other states to, unknowingly, infect others - the White House, i.e. Trump, has refused to provide tracking details for contacts of the known infected .....
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11-10-2020, 01:01 PM
25

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Hi

Omah, I value your posts.

I think you misunderstand OGF.

He would not wish ill on anyone, he is just being realistic.
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11-10-2020, 01:07 PM
26

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by swimfeeders ->
Hi

Omah, I value your posts.

I think you misunderstand OGF.

He would not wish ill on anyone, he is just being realistic.
No, I don't misunderstand him ..... he has a different viewpoint to mine .....
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11-10-2020, 03:36 PM
27

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Such doom and gloom. We are postponing until we have a) a vaccine and b) a cure. People around the world are working on both. Nobody should be encouraged to go an catch a disease which has proved to be randomly deadly, randomly disabling and with no understanding of the long term prognosis of those who recover.

Back in Feb I read a report on a research paper's findings. The report described what Covid does to the cells of the lung and how it can then damage the kidneys, heart, brain and other internal organs. It was frightening. This was at a time when many were comparing it to flu. It was enough to convince me that I don't ever want to contact this if at all possible and I am eagerly awaiting the vaccine. None of us know what card we will be dealt with on infection but the older you are the more severe it is. That much is known.
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11-10-2020, 03:43 PM
28

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
Such doom and gloom. We are postponing until we have a) a vaccine and b) a cure. People around the world are working on both. Nobody should be encouraged to go an catch a disease which has proved to be randomly deadly, randomly disabling and with no understanding of the long term prognosis of those who recover.

Back in Feb I read a report on a research paper's findings. The report described what Covid does to the cells of the lung and how it can then damage the kidneys, heart, brain and other internal organs. It was frightening. This was at a time when many were comparing it to flu. It was enough to convince me that I don't ever want to contact this if at all possible and I am eagerly awaiting the vaccine. None of us know what card we will be dealt with on infection but the older you are the more severe it is. That much is known.
Great post Annie.
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11-10-2020, 03:59 PM
29

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
Such doom and gloom. We are postponing until we have a) a vaccine and b) a cure. People around the world are working on both. Nobody should be encouraged to go an catch a disease which has proved to be randomly deadly, randomly disabling and with no understanding of the long term prognosis of those who recover.
I don't think there will ever be a "cure" for Covid-19, at least not in the conventional sense. Look at HIV-AIDS, that's been around for, what, 35-40years or so that we know about, and there's still no effective cure, just a series of drugs that control it's impact on the body. There is no effective vaccine for it yet.

I'm HOPING a vaccine for C-19 is easier to develop than that and I'll be clamouring for a shot as soon as it becomes available to the general public. In the meantime it's mask, hands and space for V and me.
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11-10-2020, 05:41 PM
30

Re: Post-Covid Brain fog

Originally Posted by Omah ->
You are, of course, entitled to that viewpoint but it is one that I consider to be blinkered and, coincidentally, one that Donald Trump seems to endorse by inviting 2,000 people to gather, unmasked and undistanced, on the grounds of the (already infected) White House .....
Omah, I don't think for one moment that anyone is advocating ignoring sensible precautions such as face masks and distancing ... unless of course, like Trump, you believe catching covid is a blessing from God. Stupid man. He'll be forever remembered for suggesting people inject with disinfectant.

But . .. and this 'but' will get bigger and more relevant as time goes on .... how long will localised lockdowns be sustainable ?
Ideally, the whole world ought to simply 'stop' 'stay at home' 'do nothing' come to a total standstill to stop the virus in its tracks or at least confine it until not one person remains alive with it to transmit it to someone else..
That is just not doable.

I suspect we're going to have to learn to live with it instead, much like flu or Aids.
To handle the necessary medical backup required to do that we don't need an economy crippled onto its knees because it was bankrupted paying people to stay at home.

It makes for horrific reading.

For the current financial year (April 2020 to April 2021), it could be anywhere from £263bn to £391bn, according to the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which keeps tabs on government spending.

And that article was dated August 11th .. so will be out of date.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52663523

Imagine if the NHS had been awarded even half of that to help it cope, though a song and dance was made of the governments largesse by writing off its £13.4 billion of debt in April.
At the outset there were some who advocated letting the NHS run 'hot' rather than that awful jingoistic ... Protect the NHS.
It's going to ruin more lives trying to avoid/contain/cure Covid than the actual damage caused by the virus itself.
 
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