Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

Hi

I agree.

I started the thread about the UK leaving NATO because of the risk of Erdogan dragging us into a war with Russia.

NATO has now told Erdogan in no uncertain terms that if he picks a fight with Russia, NATO will not join in.

Marvellous news.

As for joining the EU, well this is apparently his latest set of demands regarding the Syrian Refugees and EU Membership.

http://www.ibtimes.com/eu-turkey-sum...mands-2332065?

I do hope that he is refused.

There are two things in particular.

He still has not done anything to earn the first 3 Billion Euros, he is still creating refugees by shelling Kurdish Areas, even after the ceasefire and his demands to tell us how many and what kind of Refugees the EU has to take are pure blackmail.

Secondly, Merkel invited the Migrants in, so Germany should pay, not the EU.

This entire fiasco is a German thing, they had no remit from the EU, not even discussed.

Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

Not everyone in Europe is happy about the Ukraine situation nor about the Turkish one but democrocy has less and less power in the EU as is seen by Europes reaction to the proposed Dutch referendum.

http://www.dutchnews.nl/features/2016/01/83847/

Although the outcome of this vote wont be binding for the Ducht govt given that the general elections are due in a year Mr Rutte will be holding his breath beacuse this could just spell out his downfall.

Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

Hi

Thank you for that brilliant post Cass.

I am not happy with Cameron and his Referendum, an awful lot of risk.

To my mind, what Cameron should have done is to form an alliance with the other EU States who are not happy with the EU in it's present form.

The EU is run by Germany and France for their own interests.

I seriously object to this.

The UK, with a strong and intelligent PM, could have made an alliance with those EU Countries who share our concerns.

We could have, and should have, arranged a simultaneous Referendum with all these Countries voting on the same day to go back to a simple Free Trade Area, no more Political Integration, a return of National Sovereignty, all the advantages, none of the disadvantages.

The current Migrant Crisis is an ideal time to do this, even Austria is turning it's back on Germany.

Poland is fighting EU interference in it's internal affairs, Hungary is voting against the EU proposals on immigration, the Middle European Countries are as one against admitting the Ukraine.

We could have won this, with no risk of an Economic downside.

Cameron is an idiot.

It is the Charge of the Light Brigade all over again.

Heroic but stupid.

The objective of the exercise is to win, to change a completely wasteful, self serving EU, run in the interests of France and Germany, at no cost to UK PLC.

I know, perhaps more than some of you, how the system operates, I was part of it for a time.

I know all about Brussels and the Eurocrats, the unelected Bureaucracy who run it for their own interests.

Yes, it is great jetting off to Rome Business Class, four star hotels and expenses, or going Eurostar once a week to Brussels, eating in some of the best restaurants, taxis everywhere and a daily expense allowance, tax free, irrespective of whether or not you spent it.

A tight fisted Northerner, I soon rebelled , the waste was enormous.

You should have seen the looks on their faces when I suggested that we could save a fortune just by video conferencing, I might as well have have stood up and peed on the floor in front of them, they were so horrified.

Out as soon as I could.

Cameron has played this all wrong, the EU should be dismantled in it's current form, but he should have dismantled it at no Financial Risk to the UK.

That is his job, we elected him to look after the UK.

He has totally failed to do this.

Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

Perhaps this is still a possibility if we can get out now.

As other EU countries, including the Netherlands and others which you mentioned, are similarly dissatisfied with the Franco-German alliance, I can imagine at least some of them following our lead. We and they could form a competitive free-trade organisation without the need for any political interference. This in itself could prompt even more countries to leave the EU and join the new free-trade area. Before you know it, France and Germany would be left alone to dictate only to themselves.

Now that would be funny!

Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

One of the reasons there is so much concern about the UK referendum is the growing dissatisfaction by European people at being told what to do by a central body. Prices have soared since the introduction of the euro and people are getting sick of it.

Some of those in power are worried that other countries may follow suit if the UK votes out.

Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

And if the EU fragments we can all go back to the good old days and start killing each other again.

Re: Dancing with the Devil !!

But you forget that other little organisation, NATO.

You know, the one that Brussels conveniently forgets about when it claims that the EU is the reason we have not had another world war since 1945 (long before the EU was dreamed of, incidentally)!

Sorry to disappoint, but all this scaremongering doesn't wash with me.