Re: How far sexuality

I simply meant that we are born with some things pre-programmed within us, such as our sexuality and can't change it, so "lifestyle choice" isn't always a choice...

Re: How far sexuality

It there isn't an element of "choice", why is it that the majority of males who present themselves as gay, via the media, always come across as middle class liberals?. Imo.

Re: How far sexuality

Middle class liberals are likely to be the social grouping most accepting of "difference" so it makes sense to be part of that grouping.

Re: How far sexuality

still don't quite get this one PM - so let me ask the guy who is born obviously male and then at an much older age goes if for a sex change op - what was he pre-programmed with?

Re: How far sexuality

You seem to be labouring this Davo, but I can't seem to put my opinion any simpler for you.

Are you saying that you think gender and sexuality are all a matter of choice, and as we potter through life we can decide to have a change at will, say from hetero to homo or from male to female?

Re: How far sexuality

You are right Barry, when a person changes mid stream, they have been leading the wrong life up to the point of realisation.

Re: How far sexuality

I have absolute respect for the 'born male' to then become a woman, they are such gentle beings, at least the ones I have come across and their life must be traumatic at times. There is also an element of 'jumping on the bandwagon' in some cases, its so in yer face - makes me cringe ! I'm not sure, in those cases, they were born to be that way - just an observation..

Re: How far sexuality

- that's a pretty simple explanation that's for sure

a labored discussion heh - well beats a liberal one any day. Our world today makes gender and sexuality a matter of choice, and yes we can decide to have a change at will - it's call Transgender surgery plus hormone treatment.

This whole area is a complex one both biological and psychological and cannot be put as simply as you envisage.

In 1980, the American Psychiatric Association added gender identity disorder to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (DSM). While controversial, this was seen as a way to ensure that transgender people had access to care. In a nod to progress, the next DSM will replace "gender identity disorder" with "gender dysphoria" as a diagnosis.

try this one too and keep a simple open mind - I'm just planting ideas man!

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2013/04/transgender.aspx

you may have opened a can of worms!