Join for free
Page 8 of 15 « First < 6 7 8 9 10 > Last »
Zaphod's Avatar
Zaphod
Senior Member
Zaphod is offline
Lincs UK
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 3,990
Zaphod is male  Zaphod has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 05:47 PM
71

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by JBR ->
Yes, though that depends on how the majority of Scots feel when their next election comes along.

I really don't understand how the SNP gained a majority vote in the first place. Perhaps the Scots know something that I don't.
Well partly because the SNP are the only truly Scottish party ........ but please remember that in the GE for example the SNP only got 45% of the Scottish vote, down from 46.5% in the 2016 Scottish Parliamentaries.

There are other reasons but I don't want to cause more rancour than we have already seen here, all because I asked the most basic questions that every Scots voter should want answering fully and honestly before making a decision.
Roxy's Avatar
Roxy
Chatterbox
Roxy is offline
Caithness.
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 7,592
Roxy is female  Roxy has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 06:43 PM
72

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by shropshiregirl ->
weedeek and Roxy, I know you won't believe this but I am sure many English, Welsh and NI people resonate with your utmost desire to be an independent country. Good God, we should understand as we ourselves have had to endure almost 5 years of crap from the EU, our treasonous MPs, opposition parties, CBI, Bank of England Governor, USA Presidents, London elites, as well as obnoxious B List and Z List Celebrity Knobheads.
I have had so many heart in my mouth moments myself every time a deadline date came and went during these damned trade talks, I am exhausted!
so I do sympathise with your yearning for freedom

But... there is where my sympathy ends. There is a big difference between our freedom from the EU and your freedom from the Union. It is so blatantly obvious the SNP hate the English and independence takes pride of place at the cost of everything else. including the once vibrant Scottish economy taking second place, Our freedom from the EU was decided upon by a legitimate and democratic vote. Remain or Leave? We all, each of us had but one vote each and we chose to Leave. End of.

6 years ago, The Scottish people were given the same free vote - Remain or Leave? The Scottish people chose to Remain in the Union. The canny Scots obviously weighed up the pro's and con's and made their decision.

''Once in a Decade'' was promoted by the SNP themselves before your vote for independence. One can therefore only conclude that they were so confident of winning they wanted nothing to change during the next 25 years. (a decade in my eyes) So, 25 years? yet, because the decision didn't go your way, after just 6 years you are quite happy to disrespect the choice your own people made with the reason being that ''we didn't vote to Leave the EU''. Can you not see how undemocratic your want for a second referendum is ? It's as good as smacking democracy in the face!
As to your desire to rejoin the EU. You would obviously have no choice but to use the Euro, so saying you would choose your own currency doesn't wash. That is if you were ever allowed to even join the EU as unfortunately, barring a miracle, Scotland will never fit the EU criteria with your economy the way it is.
.
But there you are, Like everyone else on here, I am just an armchair warrior and nothing I say will make one bit of difference to what is to be. I'm only commenting on what I see and read and I feel for the people of Scotland having the SNP in government and totally disrespecting their decision.
Hi SG, I read your post with a lot of interest, please let me reply in kind by laying my own feelings on the line.
First and formost I only want what I feel is, IMO, best for my country, and I feel that getting out from under Westminster's thumb is right.

What hacks me off big style is people assuming that because I think that way, I'm some kind of crazy nationalist who is blindly in love with the SNP, and who hates the English people. Well that couldn't be further from the truth. The SNP do things that I don't agree with and don't like.
They are a means to an end for me, and should independence be gained they can easily be voted out in an election should the Scots want that.
NEITHER, do I want us to be taken back into the EU again, sheeezze no way..

But none of that gives certain people the right to have a go at me because of my feelings. Nor does it give them the right to demand, yes demand, proof of things I haven't a hope of getting my hands on. I am not privvy to the SNPs Manifesto. FFS.
Nor am I going to do their googling for them, they can damn well do it themselves.

There is far too much just assuming in these threads, it's usually the wrong end of the stick, it's hurtful, and it's down right insulting, and causes all sorts of bad feelings.
When I first joined here, years back you could go into any section of the forum and talk about things, now it's a ruddy minefield ruled over by a few who will rip you to pieces if they don't like what you say.
Soooooo, there you have it. My opinion, my right to it.
shropshiregirl's Avatar
shropshiregirl
Chatterbox
shropshiregirl is offline
Shropshire
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 6,919
shropshiregirl is female  shropshiregirl has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 06:58 PM
73

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by Roxy ->
Hi SG, I read your post with a lot of interest, please let me reply in kind by laying my own feelings on the line.
First and formost I only want what I feel is, IMO, best for my country, and I feel that getting out from under Westminster's thumb is right.

What hacks me off big style is people assuming that because I think that way, I'm some kind of crazy nationalist who is blindly in love with the SNP, and who hates the English people. Well that couldn't be further from the truth. The SNP do things that I don't agree with and don't like.
They are a means to an end for me, and should independence be gained they can easily be voted out in an election should the Scots want that.
NEITHER, do I want us to be taken back into the EU again, sheeezze no way..

But none of that gives certain people the right to have a go at me because of my feelings. Nor does it give them the right to demand, yes demand, proof of things I haven't a hope of getting my hands on. I am not privvy to the SNPs Manifesto. FFS.
Nor am I going to do their googling for them, they can damn well do it themselves.

There is far too much just assuming in these threads, it's usually the wrong end of the stick, it's hurtful, and it's down right insulting, and causes all sorts of bad feelings.
When I first joined here, years back you could go into any section of the forum and talk about things, now it's a ruddy minefield ruled over by a few who will rip you to pieces if they don't like what you say.
Soooooo, there you have it. My opinion, my right to it.
Never mind Roxy, Do what I do, wear a prettily bedecked with flowers helmet and take aim at others from behind the sofa!!
Roxy's Avatar
Roxy
Chatterbox
Roxy is offline
Caithness.
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 7,592
Roxy is female  Roxy has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 07:23 PM
74

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by shropshiregirl ->
Never mind Roxy, Do what I do, wear a prettily bedecked with flowers helmet and take aim at others from behind the sofa!!
Ha Ha Ha, Now that made me laugh for the first time today. Thanks.
Zaphod's Avatar
Zaphod
Senior Member
Zaphod is offline
Lincs UK
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 3,990
Zaphod is male  Zaphod has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 07:26 PM
75

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by shropshiregirl ->
Never mind Roxy, Do what I do, wear a prettily bedecked with flowers helmet and take aim at others from behind the sofa!!
I think that's what Roxy is having a "dig" at; she stuck her head out and tried to lob a few bricks, then didn't like it when they were returned as a wall.
If you don't like being challenged don't make controversial posts is the obvious retort.


I see Sturgeon is facing trouble - from Labour, no less.

' The Labour peer George Foulkes said Ofcom should insist on BBC Scotland changing the TV coverage to remove the First Minister.
He claimed BBC Scotland wouldn’t do so without being forced “because they feel intimidated by the overbearing attitude of the Scottish Government”. '
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...briefings-bbc/

The Scottish Government - intimidating and overbearing?
Would that be why their supporters display similar attitudes d'you think?
weedeek
Senior Member
weedeek is offline
Dumfries, Scotland
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 434
weedeek is male  weedeek has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 07:28 PM
76

Re: Scotland and the EU

Backing up Roxy, the SNP is a movement , a means to an end. I do believe that Scotland is big enough, rich enough and smart enough to run its own affairs if that’s what the majority of voters want, which is by no means guaranteed , that’s democracy. For myself, I’d like to see an independent Scotland with a Labour Party I can vote for again. I am also pro-EU unlike Roxy, but that’s fine, whether we apply to join will be our choice. That’s it, end of. Stay safe.
Zaphod's Avatar
Zaphod
Senior Member
Zaphod is offline
Lincs UK
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 3,990
Zaphod is male  Zaphod has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 07:58 PM
77

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by weedeek ->
Backing up Roxy, the SNP is a movement , a means to an end. I do believe that Scotland is big enough, rich enough and smart enough to run its own affairs if that’s what the majority of voters want, which is by no means guaranteed , that’s democracy. For myself, I’d like to see an independent Scotland with a Labour Party I can vote for again. I am also pro-EU unlike Roxy, but that’s fine, whether we apply to join will be our choice. That’s it, end of. Stay safe.
I too believe that Scotland is big enough, rich enough and smart enough to run its' own affairs as an independent country.
But not under the SNP, who are untrustworthy - and certainly not under the jackboot of the EU who are even more untrustworthy.
As I've shown before; the Shetlands agree to the extent that they would rather become a Crown Dependency.

The only way an independent Scotland can become reality is if voters accept a dramatic reduction in both the standard of living and their income, because very simply there ain't enough money in the country to keep things as they currently are.

Last year - with no covid and no major dilemmas - saw Scotland reach a defecit of 8.6% of GDP - in other words many billions of British pounds for that year alone.
How are six million people realistically supposed to make that sum appear out of thin air to provide the same standard of living which they have now?
Especially if much of the seas and the oil (for what that's worth) go to the Shetlands rather than an independent Scotland.

Now you might understand why I keep asking about a realistic budget proposal from the SNP before people can be expected to make an informed decision.

Oh and it's not just me saying ther would be money difficulties, and nor is it just The Times I've quoted before.
There's a lot written but here's one explanation.

"GERS FIGURES DON'T LIE, DESPITE WHAT INDEPENDENCE SUPPORTERS SAY"
https://www.these-islands.co.uk/publ...rters_say.aspx

You might like to note that the author too saw denial and denouncing of facts as the response.
JBR's Avatar
JBR
Chatterbox
JBR is offline
Cheshire, UK
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 32,785
JBR is male  JBR has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 09:16 PM
78

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by Zaphod ->
Well partly because the SNP are the only truly Scottish party ........ but please remember that in the GE for example the SNP only got 45% of the Scottish vote, down from 46.5% in the 2016 Scottish Parliamentaries.

There are other reasons but I don't want to cause more rancour than we have already seen here, all because I asked the most basic questions that every Scots voter should want answering fully and honestly before making a decision.
I agree.

Among our Scottish friends and relatives, both here and in Scotland, I never hear any of this ranting and raving.

Either I just never come into contact with SNP supporters or, in actuality, they really are very much a minority...
though a very vociferous minority!
Reality1
Senior Member
Reality1 is offline
Scotland
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 260
Reality1 is male  Reality1 has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 09:27 PM
79

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by Zaphod ->
I too believe that Scotland is big enough, rich enough and smart enough to run its' own affairs as an independent country.
But not under the SNP, who are untrustworthy - and certainly not under the jackboot of the EU who are even more untrustworthy.
As I've shown before; the Shetlands agree to the extent that they would rather become a Crown Dependency.

The only way an independent Scotland can become reality is if voters accept a dramatic reduction in both the standard of living and their income, because very simply there ain't enough money in the country to keep things as they currently are.

Last year - with no covid and no major dilemmas - saw Scotland reach a defecit of 8.6% of GDP - in other words many billions of British pounds for that year alone.
How are six million people realistically supposed to make that sum appear out of thin air to provide the same standard of living which they have now?
Especially if much of the seas and the oil (for what that's worth) go to the Shetlands rather than an independent Scotland.

Now you might understand why I keep asking about a realistic budget proposal from the SNP before people can be expected to make an informed decision.

Oh and it's not just me saying ther would be money difficulties, and nor is it just The Times I've quoted before.
There's a lot written but here's one explanation.

"GERS FIGURES DON'T LIE, DESPITE WHAT INDEPENDENCE SUPPORTERS SAY"
https://www.these-islands.co.uk/publ...rters_say.aspx

You might like to note that the author too saw denial and denouncing of facts as the response.
Beware scots. This type of post is just project fear 2 on steroids...A la David Cameron style yet another Eton loser.

Scotland will be fine on its own.
We have a surplus of clean energy, excellent fishing, clean air and excellent resources. If we stay in the UK we will be dragged down to the gutter by an out of touch privileged Eton elite. They will seek to divide us, lay claim to our resources and lie again and again.
This is Westminster's worse, most corrupt English government in living memory and it will get worse as they print more money to pay their chums.

I know the SNP are not perfect but they alone are offering a way out.
OldGreyFox's Avatar
OldGreyFox
Chatterbox
OldGreyFox is offline
South Yorkshire
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 21,202
OldGreyFox is male  OldGreyFox has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
14-12-2020, 09:37 PM
80

Re: Scotland and the EU

Originally Posted by weedeek ->
Backing up Roxy, the SNP is a movement , a means to an end. I do believe that Scotland is big enough, rich enough and smart enough to run its own affairs if that’s what the majority of voters want, which is by no means guaranteed , that’s democracy. For myself, I’d like to see an independent Scotland with a Labour Party I can vote for again. I am also pro-EU unlike Roxy, but that’s fine, whether we apply to join will be our choice. That’s it, end of. Stay safe.
I can't fault you or Roxy for that weedeek, I voted for the brexit party, I didn't give a monkeys what their policies were as long as they took us out of the EU. Living in a labour stronghold I had no idea that the people of South Yorkshire would have voted for a tory government, but they did, and the conservatives won several seats that had been previously been labour. Unfortunately, labour regained Doncaster Central but not by much. Perhaps if I, and a couple more had voted Tory, even my constituency would have turned blue.

It makes no difference to me which way a future Scottish independence vote goes, but I would be sad to see you leave the UK. All the countries in the union (Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and England) bring their own unique customs and identity that makes Britain the force on the world stage that it has always been.....Long may it continue....
 
Page 8 of 15 « First < 6 7 8 9 10 > Last »



© Copyright 2009, Over50sForum   Contact Us | Over 50s Forum! | Archive | Privacy Statement | Terms of Use | Top

Powered by vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.