Re: Canada-style deal

It seems that there's some confusion here.

So we CAN agree free trade agreements with other countries.

But you say that WTO free trade deals are Canada-style deals.

Yet Canada-style deals strongly favour the EU:

https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-wh...-deal-11096397

For example:

"Despite talk of liberalising trade in services between Canada and the EU, the agreement is far from comprehensive - with hundreds of exceptions listed - and CETA does not guarantee Canadian firms an EU financial services "passport".

"This means they will still face hurdles to trading freely on the continent.

"CETA also does not remove non-tariff barriers such as EU rules of origin requirements, while some sensitive agricultural products such as eggs or chicken are not covered by the agreement."

When we are again an independent nation, we will be at liberty to create our own trade deals with any countries we wish (though not the dictatorial EU), and these will comprise any rules that we and the other countries agree.

This is why I could never be happy in being beholden to the EU.

Re: Canada-style deal

You will never get rid of non tariff barriers no matter how you try. it's non tariff barriers that will be the real killer in any trade renegotiations. That's why it's far simpler to make a deal where we don't have to renegotiate because the EU has far bigger clout and has already done all the donkey work to give us access to a large part of the planet. Recently Japan has been added.

Re: Canada-style deal

This brings me back to what I said earlier.

If Japan (and others) are willing to trade with us whilst we are in the EU, why should they be unwilling to agree a similar trade agreement with us after we have left.

I can't see how the EU can prevent it if both sides are in agreement, and I'm sure that Japan (and others) would be happy to trade with us on mutually beneficial terms.

Anyway, although I'm sure that some will disagree with me, why don't we just wait and see?

Of course, I am assuming (and hoping) that Theresa the Appeaser doesn't just cave in and keep us in the EU in all but name. After all, she is stupid enough to sacrifice her party in government which, I'm sure, would be the inevitable consequence. She was half way there in the last GE, after all!

Re: Canada-style deal

We are not the EU. So they would have to unbundle our bits and that takes time. Who knows whether Japan would not want more favourable terms. We aren't as big a market. All of it is just a load of time consuming hassle and red tape hell.

Far easier to pay to latch onto the trade agreements we already have.

Re: Canada-style deal

I have to admit that I have no idea what is entailed in 'unbundling our bits'!

And why should it take time? When (and if) we eventually leave the EU, they will have absolutely no hold over us. I am, of course, assuming that May will not leave us tied into their dictatorship!

Re: Canada-style deal

Apparently as part of the EU quotas are negotiated and if you have your own separate agreement they have to remove your bits from the EU bits and you then have to settle for a less favourable deal because the EU has more clout than small beer like us. It's all terribly boring. It's discussed in the link below if you can bear to look.

http://trade.ec.europa.eu/tradehelp/quotas

But the main thing is that we will end up worse off by going and renegotiating it alone because the EU is a big player so they can say give us better terms. We will struggle so no matter how easy you think it will be we will never be able to get better terms in deals than we have now.

Whether it's worth the money is the question. The way it works now the government pays out and companies benefit. In future that burden is going to pass to businesses.

Re: Canada-style deal

So I am struggling to understand how we will be better off by going with a no deal scenario. Nobody has explained it yet in a way that takes all these hidden costs into account.

It's all very well glossing over the detail and saying it will all be fine but the fact is that we are not great at negotiating good deals. We don't have a brilliant track record of that. Or maybe someone could give me an example where we have negotiated something that leaves us in a better position than before?

Even our power systems are run by mainly foreign run companies because our own are not competitive enough. Scottish power is apparently Spanish owned. EDF is french etc. We don't seem to have the skills or maybe there is complacency or expediency in the decisions.

Re: Canada-style deal

I think that sounds rather defeatist, to be honest. I can understand that the EU is a bigger organisation than the UK, but the eventual outcome depends basically on how much Japan (and others) would like to trade with us.

Remember that UK motorists provide a large market for Japanese cars, among other things.

Re: Canada-style deal

I'm sure you are underplaying our strengths as the world's 6th largest economy.

The reason so many of our utilities are foreign owned is a direct result of EU law.....Nothing to do with competetiveness. Although if you can prove otherwise, please do.

One thing is for sure. Countries will be falling over themselves to arrange post Brexit trading arrangements with the UK once we are ableto officially sign them off.
Why wouldn't they ?

Re: Canada-style deal

What springs immediately to mind is the savings we shall make by not paying our 'leaving fee' of £40 billion plus, of course, no annual 'membership fee'.

The really big advantage, though, as far as I'm concerned is the regaining of our sovereignty and no longer being obliged to follow diktats made by foreigners in Brussels.

We have been limited in many ways for many years, and I am confident that we shall be able to stand on our own two feet.