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18-01-2020, 12:29 PM
221

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by bakerman ->
No insult intended but, for the life of me I can not understand why the people of the U.K. need a monarchy in the first place. And then to be forced to pay for their every little need and desire. It seems to me that the days of having a monarchy are long passed. Seriously, what makes them royal in the 1st place ? Hmm ? Just merely being born ?
Well it stems from time immemorial. In any community there was a leader, usually a male and the strongest one there.

Later, as communities expanded to nations, the leader was known as the King and, again, was the strongest man there. He was supported by other men who were given responsibility for ruling (and collecting taxes) in their own county (Counts, later called Earls in this country although to be accurate the term Earl preceded the term Count - Comte in the case of the Normans).

At the time of Oliver Cromwell, he and his supporters decided that they'd had enough of the King because he was living the life of Riley and they weren't, so along came the 'Commonwealth'.

A few years later, they decided that having a King wasn't such a bad idea after all, but when reinstating him (a different one, actually, the old one had been beheaded) they decided that he and his successors should not be all powerful any more, so restrictions were put in place and Parliament held the real power.

And here's the crunch. Suddenly, the King was no longer as influential and Parliament, in return for taking all his income from taxes and keeping them for themselves, agreed to pay him the 'Civil List'. That is what we have today. Instead of the King (or Queen) receiving all the taxes and using the money as he wished, Parliament grabs the lot and uses the money as they wish - largely for their own benefit, of course! In return, the Queen receives a small portion of that money for her benefit.

In my opinion, the Queen is beneficial to this country and draws in more money from abroad than she receives.

Republicans should be careful in insisting that the monarchy should be disestablished because their taxes will not reduce; the money that is presently paid to the Queen will instead be added to what the government receives and will still be irresponsibly spent - foreign aid, for example.

I can assure you that if there was no Royal Family we would not be better off ourselves. If anything things would be worse for us!
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18-01-2020, 12:50 PM
222

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by JBR ->
Well it stems from time immemorial. In any community there was a leader, usually a male and the strongest one there.

Later, as communities expanded to nations, the leader was known as the King and, again, was the strongest man there. He was supported by other men who were given responsibility for ruling (and collecting taxes) in their own county (Counts, later called Earls in this country although to be accurate the term Earl preceded the term Count - Comte in the case of the Normans).

At the time of Oliver Cromwell, he and his supporters decided that they'd had enough of the King because he was living the life of Riley and they weren't, so along came the 'Commonwealth'.

A few years later, they decided that having a King wasn't such a bad idea after all, but when reinstating him (a different one, actually, the old one had been beheaded) they decided that he and his successors should not be all powerful any more, so restrictions were put in place and Parliament held the real power.

And here's the crunch. Suddenly, the King was no longer as influential and Parliament, in return for taking all his income from taxes and keeping them for themselves, agreed to pay him the 'Civil List'. That is what we have today. Instead of the King (or Queen) receiving all the taxes and using the money as he wished, Parliament grabs the lot and uses the money as they wish - largely for their own benefit, of course! In return, the Queen receives a small portion of that money for her benefit.

In my opinion, the Queen is beneficial to this country and draws in more money from abroad than she receives.

Republicans should be careful in insisting that the monarchy should be disestablished because their taxes will not reduce; the money that is presently paid to the Queen will instead be added to what the government receives and will still be irresponsibly spent - foreign aid, for example.

I can assure you that if there was no Royal Family we would not be better off ourselves. If anything things would be worse for us!
Succinctly put .....
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18-01-2020, 12:56 PM
223

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by Omah ->
Succinctly put .....
But wrong. The publicity and pure BS put about by "The Firm" creates and maintains this illusion but all too slowly the smoke is clearing.
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18-01-2020, 12:58 PM
224

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by bakerman ->
No insult intended but, for the life of me I can not understand why the people of the U.K. need a monarchy in the first place. And then to be forced to pay for their every little need and desire. It seems to me that the days of having a monarchy are long passed. Seriously, what makes them royal in the 1st place ? Hmm ? Just merely being born ?
The US "monarchy" - presidents and their families, past and present - cost the US taxpayer billions per year:

Guess How Much it Cost Taxpayers to Protect the First Family
By NATHAN REIFF
Updated Nov 14, 2016
With the 2016 U.S. Presidential election having dominated headlines for many months, many taxpaying U.S. citizens may be wondering exactly how much of their money goes toward protecting and caring for the President's family each day. The U.S. President, often considered the "leader of the free world," is one of the very most prominent figures in the world, and the citizens of the U.S. pay for protection for the President and the First Family through their tax dollars. But exactly how much money does it take to cover the associated expenses, and what exactly is required?

Security
Perhaps the biggest concern for the President and the First Family, at least in terms of taxpayer dollars, is security. Due to the extremely high profile of virtually everyone in close connection with any sitting President, a huge team of secret service security agents must be employed at all times to protect the President and anyone in the President's immediate family. According to the Brookings Institution's Bradley Patterson, these expenses were among the largest for the Obama presidency. All told, the cost to taxpayers associated with running the White House under President Obama was approximately $1.4 billion per year.

Staffing
Beyond constant security personnel, Presidents and their families also require huge numbers of non-security staff to manage everything from important matters of state to maintaining the White House to scheduling and much, much more. Salaries for all of these staff members are drawn from taxpayer dollars too. Among the most important staff for any sitting president are the team of doctors and other emergency specialists employed to accompany the president throughout all travel and other activities.

Travel
The cost of presidential travel must be covered by taxpayer funds as well. It is not uncommon for sitting U.S. presidents to travel via Air Force One many times per week, often multiple times per day. As with any private airplane, the costs associated with maintaining Air Force One and for travel are extensive, all the more so because the plane must be fully staffed and outfitted at virtually any hour of the day, depending upon the needs of the President.

Entertainment
A portion of taxpayer funds also go to providing various non-essential entertainment and luxury items that have come to be associated with the White House and the presidency. The staff at the White House includes cooks, event planners, staff for the in-house cinema, and more. When the presidential family brings a pet with them to the White House, the costs associated with the pet are also included in taxpayer bills, too. Though breakdowns of the exact cost of each of these expenses are difficult to come by, the total when taken together can be enormous.
Some presidents, of course, take nepotism to extremes ......

Naturally, ex-presidents retain many of those benefits for life .....

People in glass houses, etc.

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18-01-2020, 01:04 PM
225

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by The Artful Todger ->
But wrong. The publicity and pure BS put about by "The Firm" creates and maintains this illusion but all too slowly the smoke is clearing.
You, of course, may say so .....
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18-01-2020, 01:40 PM
226

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by The Artful Todger ->
But wrong. The publicity and pure BS put about by "The Firm" creates and maintains this illusion but all too slowly the smoke is clearing.
Absolutely!
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18-01-2020, 06:53 PM
227

Re: What A Loss (?)

The Australian republicans want another vote on Monarchy.


https://www.canberratimes.com.au/sto...o-republicans/
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18-01-2020, 08:45 PM
228

Re: What A Loss (?)

It's high time Harry sat Meghan down and asked her what he thinks.
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18-01-2020, 08:51 PM
229

Re: What A Loss (?)

Originally Posted by Cinderella ->
The Australian republicans want another vote on Monarchy.


https://www.canberratimes.com.au/sto...o-republicans/
Another development to upset the poor Queen. At her age too.

Andrew, then Hairy, and now Australia.
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Lindyloo
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isle of wight
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18-01-2020, 08:58 PM
230

Re: What A Loss (?)

Harry and Meghan will not use HRH titles - and no public funds for Royal duties!
 
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