02-04-2014, 06:26 PM
21
Re: Who Is Nigel Farage
Do you really think it is worth 55 million a day to stay in !What have they done for us to warrant that money ?
Seeing the programme, they have built a huge stadium of a building and sit there blankly day in day out. The whole thing is a nonsense, wheres the benefits .....?
Welcome by the way .....
02-04-2014, 06:59 PM
22
Re: Who Is Nigel Farage
Originally Posted by Patsy
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Do you really think it is worth 55 million a day to stay in !What have they done for us to warrant that money ?
Seeing the programme, they have built a huge stadium of a building and sit there blankly day in day out. The whole thing is a nonsense, wheres the benefits .....?
Welcome by the way .....
Well, one example of what we get is the huge amount of European investment back, particularly in poorer areas such as where I live - South Yorkshire.
If you mean the European Parliament building, well democracy costs money. The fact we sit in a parliament alongside 28 other countries making decisions about our continent's future is far more important than being a 'Little England' sniping from the edges. In a world of super powers and power blocks, what alternative is there if you want us to keep relevant.
The most obvious benefit to us is freedom to travel, live, work, study and retire anywhere in the EU (this also applies to other EEA states). Roughly 1.6 million Brits live in the EU outside the UK. After living in another EU country for five years you have the same rights as its own citizens. But other ones that I appreciate include:
EU citizens have a vote in local and European Parliament elections wherever they live in the EU
Working abroad is easy through mutual recognition of qualifications, enabling us to work in another EU country without having to sit further examinations.
Travelling and working abroad in the EU is easier by introduction of the European driving licence, with standard driving tests and minimum standards of fitness to drive. This improved road safety and made it easier to cross international borders.
Phones - national monopolies were abolished for fixed line services, leading to a fall in the price of phone calls, and more choice of equipment and providers. Since 2000, the cost of a 10-minute call has fallen by an average of 74 per cent in the EU.
That's just a few that spring to mind.
02-04-2014, 07:04 PM
23
Re: Who Is Nigel Farage
Originally Posted by manasota
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My first reply on here. It never ceases to amaze me how virulently anti-European so many people in this country are without having any genuine reason other than nonsense like they're going to outlaw the British sausage and suchlike. Specifically on Farage, just remember this guy is to all intents and purposes, a Conservative with identical policies on just about everything, and the three things he's most associated with - withdrawal from the EU, immigration, and protecting the pound - are core to Conservative philosophy. So how is he or his party any different? How many anti-Europeans actually experience anything negative that can be directly attributable to our membership? Other than whatever lies are served up in the Daily Mail etc?
All I know is that I have far more in common with the ordinary German/Spaniard/Italian/Pole than I ever could have with the likes of Farage.
However, in answer to your first question I would say that most people do have good reason to be anti European for the myriad of reasons cited by Nigel Farage, such as an ever burgeoning expensive bureaucracy, unaccountable unelected bureaucrats, excessive fraud and yes, uncontrollable immigration, which are but a few of the many of what I would say are reasonable matters for reticence.
Secondly I would say that Farage is at least a Conservative by nature which I couldn't say about Cameron, who I doubt has any intention of leaving Europe because like most politicians he sees that as his future gravy train when his present one runs dry.
Thirdly I would ask you what paper you read or what news programme do you watch that doesn't have bias, and why therefore single out the Daily Mail amongst the dailies?
Regarding your final paragraph may I say that we all probably have much in common with the common working man in most countries, but I'm afraid politicians don't fit into that category, they just see their populace as cannon fodder and the greater good is usually just their greater good and not ours.
Or am I being rather cynical.....
02-04-2014, 08:28 PM
25
Re: Who Is Nigel Farage
However, in answer to your first question I would say that most people do have good reason to be anti European for the myriad of reasons cited by Nigel Farage, such as an ever burgeoning expensive bureaucracy, unaccountable unelected bureaucrats, excessive fraud and yes, uncontrollable immigration, which are but a few of the many of what I would say are reasonable matters for reticence.Secondly I would say that Farage is at least a Conservative by nature which I couldn't say about Cameron, who I doubt has any intention of leaving Europe because like most politicians he sees that as his future gravy train when his present one runs dry.
Thirdly I would ask you what paper you read or what news programme do you watch that doesn't have bias, and why therefore single out the Daily Mail amongst the dailies?
Regarding your final paragraph may I say that we all probably have much in common with the common working man in most countries, but I'm afraid politicians don't fit into that category, they just see their populace as cannon fodder and the greater good is usually just their greater good and not ours.
Or am I being rather cynical.....
[/QUOTE]OK Plantman - in reverse order!
everyone is 'cynical' about politicians but WE all elect them, and WE all have the right to stand. But the biggest moaners would never do it themselves. And despite expenses scandals and the like, many - if not most - elected politicians (local as well as national) are just people like us trying to do their best for very little thanks and a lot of abuse. What are the alternatives? A dictatorship?
I read (online) most newspapers, plus various blogs, and the BBC. The Daily Mail I find particularly loathsome as they peddle and promote bigotry . And I never forget they were traitors who supported Hitler.
Agree Farage IS a Tory - but people are saying he is something different. He isn't - he's like a throwback to buffoons like Gerald Nabarro with a ladleful of populism thrown on top - the ubiquitous pint and fag does NOT make him 'one of us'
Finally, every organisation has a bureaucracy - its what makes them work. As far as I'm aware, the Euro version is relatively small. Unelected bureaucrats are everywhere - but that's why we have a democratically elected legislature, and a council of ministers - who actually DO make the decisions. The much maligned bureaucrat carries out those decisions. Fraud is everywhere and must always be rooted out - but its not peculiar to the EU; expenses fiddles are just one of many here, the LIBOR scandal another. As for immigration - I don't know what the right solution is here, but I do know its not a simple black and white issue (pun intended
)Just seen Farage 'debate' with Clegg tonight - would you honestly let this clown anywhere near the levers of power? Clegg was pitiful as usual of course. Both third rate in their ways.
Personally I always prefer idealism to cynicism
02-04-2014, 10:54 PM
28
Re: Who Is Nigel Farage
Originally Posted by spitfire
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I am a true Socialist, but am warming to Farage, yes I watched tonight's debate.
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