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Bread
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10-02-2019, 03:45 PM
101

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by swimfeeders ->
Hi

No, they apply to parts as well.

The Tariff Rate is 4.5%.

You can see the them on the WTO Site.

But we have inward processing relief ?
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Banchory
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10-02-2019, 06:05 PM
102

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Tariffs apply to finished goods not individual car parts

In the last recession there was nothing global about it. Japan, China India Canada Australia etc weren't affected anywhere near Europe and the US
Thatís why I said fairly Global

Whilst some countries banks had little exposure to toxit debt, the 2007 recess sent ripples around the world

Incidentally Japan had its own banking crisis from 1991 to 2010 they call it the lost 20 years
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marmaduke
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11-02-2019, 03:02 PM
103

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Juncker to toast Britain's exit from the UK

https://mol.im/a/6689699

As punishment for brexit

I believe itís way past time we told the EU and indeed the Irish to get stuffed


Mr Junckerís second in command, Martin Selmayr Ė nicknamed The Monster, also plans to be in Dublin, raising fears that he is secretly pushing for the EU to maintain its uncompromising negotiating stance.
Cabinet ministers have in private accused the European Commission secretary-general of secretly plotting the reunification of Ireland as punishment for Brexit.
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Bread
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11-02-2019, 03:16 PM
104

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by marmaduke ->
Juncker to toast Britain's exit from the UK

https://mol.im/a/6689699

As punishment for brexit

I believe itís way past time we told the EU and indeed the Irish to get stuffed


Mr Junckerís second in command, Martin Selmayr Ė nicknamed The Monster, also plans to be in Dublin, raising fears that he is secretly pushing for the EU to maintain its uncompromising negotiating stance.
Cabinet ministers have in private accused the European Commission secretary-general of secretly plotting the reunification of Ireland as punishment for Brexit.

I can't see Northern Ireland wanting the Euro so I think he is wasting his time.
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marmaduke
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11-02-2019, 07:00 PM
105

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Doctor S mug gives views on the poor idiots


https://youtu.be/qL4XU5EAurM
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swimfeeders
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11-02-2019, 08:12 PM
106

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by Bread ->
But we have inward processing relief ?
Hi

Nope, and that is part of the problem.

The other part of the problem is this.

Rules of Origin.

Our FTAs we have as part of the EU specify rules of origin, which for cars are 55%.

When we leave, and we must, any components manufactured here in the UK will not count towards the 55% EU total.

I have moved from the village to the town, where we have 3 big manufacturers supplying parts to EU Car Manufacturers.

This is a big issue for them, they will have to move to the EU or close.

It is not just the big boys either.

The wear plates for stamping out every BMW car panel are made here in the UK.

In a small village near here, British Engineering at it's best, a very sophisticated operation.

They are a just on time operation, they have to supply new ones in 24 hours.

The Boss is my age, a member of the same fishing club, too much hassle, selling up.

A No Deal means a certificate for every chemical consignment abroad, every food export and every meat export.

We have the British Standards Institute, accepted World Wide.

Unfortunately they cannot issue such certificates, we swapped them for EU Certificates.

A cost saving so beloved of Government.

The Certificates are required under WTO Rules for each consignment and an HGV will typically have an average of 4 consignments.

We stopped training and certification decades ago.

I cannot sign for medicines, meat or offal.

I can sign for Chemicals and processed meat and non meat foodstuff exports.

Before the cuts started, we had 5600 who could, now less than 500 who can.

We have no training courses of our own and all the EU ones are booked for months ahead.

I have mine, paid for and I have kept updated at my own expense.

I am not going to be busting a gut over this.

I will do 8 at £50 a time, one day a week, for the locals.

Hence my £400 a day Moscow.

A wage you said no one on here would believe.

I will be working for my son Guy on this and getting Minimum wage so as minimise tax liability.

I am not going to be paying 40% Tax.

I can do 4 an hour, so 2 hours a day for me and he gets the rest.

The Government by the way have agreed £117 a time.
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12-02-2019, 09:56 PM
107

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by marmaduke ->
Juncker to toast Britain's exit from the UK

https://mol.im/a/6689699

As punishment for brexit

I believe itís way past time we told the EU and indeed the Irish to get stuffed


Mr Junckerís second in command, Martin Selmayr Ė nicknamed The Monster, also plans to be in Dublin, raising fears that he is secretly pushing for the EU to maintain its uncompromising negotiating stance.
Cabinet ministers have in private accused the European Commission secretary-general of secretly plotting the reunification of Ireland as punishment for Brexit.
The EU is unreformable and dangerous. Hell will freeze over they won't change.
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Bread
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13-02-2019, 04:17 PM
108

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by swimfeeders ->
Hi

Nope, and that is part of the problem.

The other part of the problem is this.

Rules of Origin.

Our FTAs we have as part of the EU specify rules of origin, which for cars are 55%.

When we leave, and we must, any components manufactured here in the UK will not count towards the 55% EU total.

I have moved from the village to the town, where we have 3 big manufacturers supplying parts to EU Car Manufacturers.

This is a big issue for them, they will have to move to the EU or close.

It is not just the big boys either.

The wear plates for stamping out every BMW car panel are made here in the UK.

In a small village near here, British Engineering at it's best, a very sophisticated operation.

They are a just on time operation, they have to supply new ones in 24 hours.

The Boss is my age, a member of the same fishing club, too much hassle, selling up.

A No Deal means a certificate for every chemical consignment abroad, every food export and every meat export.

We have the British Standards Institute, accepted World Wide.

Unfortunately they cannot issue such certificates, we swapped them for EU Certificates.

A cost saving so beloved of Government.

The Certificates are required under WTO Rules for each consignment and an HGV will typically have an average of 4 consignments.

We stopped training and certification decades ago.

I cannot sign for medicines, meat or offal.

I can sign for Chemicals and processed meat and non meat foodstuff exports.

Before the cuts started, we had 5600 who could, now less than 500 who can.

We have no training courses of our own and all the EU ones are booked for months ahead.

I have mine, paid for and I have kept updated at my own expense.

I am not going to be busting a gut over this.

I will do 8 at £50 a time, one day a week, for the locals.

Hence my £400 a day Moscow.

A wage you said no one on here would believe.

I will be working for my son Guy on this and getting Minimum wage so as minimise tax liability.

I am not going to be paying 40% Tax.

I can do 4 an hour, so 2 hours a day for me and he gets the rest.

The Government by the way have agreed £117 a time.

Sorry for the late reply, I've been travelling with my lad, visiting universities....


I think we may be talking at crossed purposes, so I'll explain inward processing and the relief component of it as I see it.

There are 2 "types" of components (or parts) that we import, and these are not just for the motor industry, but for all sorts of others too, such as medical device, aeroplanes etc etc.

Inward processing determines how these components customs import duties are applied and if the duties can be reclaimed (relief) or not.

So, when the component is imported (say its a "widget" of some description) then it could be for "in circulation" (like a retail part) or "out of circulation" (a component which is destined for manufacturing assembly to build a "finished" product - an alternator for sale in Halfords vs the same alternator but for assembly into a Mini in Oxford etc). Although all widgets are subject to an import tariff of "x%" (0% ... x%), the inward processing determines whether that tariff can be reclaimed (relief) by their customs (HMRC in our case) or not.

What this means, is that if the "widget" is destined for a manufacturer as part of a product assembly, the tariff (duty) can be reclaimed to avoid the compounded customs charges as the component moves from country to country, otherwise it would increase the cost of manufactured goods in multi-countries exponentially depending on who does what and where.

The finished product would then only be subject to whatever tariff is applied by the destination country when it is then finally imported as a "finished goods".

So, to conclude, car parts (or any parts for assembly) are subject to tariffs (0% - x%) that can be inward processed and the tax relief reclaimed or in the case for car parts that are destined for resale (say in Halfords) cannot.

If we did not do inward processing and reclaim the import tax then it would only be cost effective to manufacture them in a single country or those within an FTA. Either way, multi-country manufacturing is done all over the world in either of these ways - there are merits to being in an FTA to do this (i.e. the EU) because it saves on a lot of paperwork but bear in mind as most is done electronically now it is no longer the admin burden it used to be way back when.


My point was that the UK as a 3rd country to the UK would do inward processing from other countries as we do now in the EU - we control what comes into the UK and we also control our applied tariffs. Its the same how the rest of the word trades using WTO rules and customs tax relief.

If, say Germany decided not to do any inward processing on your friends BMW parts then it would be pretty catastrophic for Germany to do this as it means the government would be forcing its manufacturers a lot of harm by effectively destroying its supply chain and besides if it did this to the UK it would be against WTO rules.

I hope that explains a bit better.....
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Banchory
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13-02-2019, 06:27 PM
109

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

The WTO Agreement does not cover raw materials and unfinished components which can be given inwsrd ptocessing tax relief.

The automotive industry tends to move completed components across around the EU do the IK as a third party my not be able to offer relief under WTO rules

The exception to this is the Aerospace industry which trades under a separate WTO Agreement on Trade in Civil Aircraft which the EU is party to. This allowed finished components to be eligible for tax relief. It is unclear if this UK would still remain party to it in a no deal scenario
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Bread
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13-02-2019, 07:24 PM
110

Re: Reasons in favour of brexit

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
The WTO Agreement does not cover raw materials and unfinished components which can be given inwsrd ptocessing tax relief.

The automotive industry tends to move completed components across around the EU do the IK as a third party my not be able to offer relief under WTO rules

The exception to this is the Aerospace industry which trades under a separate WTO Agreement on Trade in Civil Aircraft which the EU is party to. This allowed finished components to be eligible for tax relief. It is unclear if this UK would still remain party to it in a no deal scenario


There's also outward processing
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