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Bruce
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Wollongong, Australia
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11-04-2021, 07:06 AM
31

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

I thought Brexit was the perfect time to create a united Ireland, get rid of the thorn and money pit that is Northern Ireland. It was a wasted opportunity, something the UK government is very good at. It would have taken some skill and management to achieve it but it could have been done.
Takahashi
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11-04-2021, 07:50 AM
32

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Any chance of telling us exactly how it could be done?
Banchory
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11-04-2021, 07:53 AM
33

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
We did have better ones but standards are very much different to rules, especially when standards and rules favour Germany and not the UK.

I did vote to leave believing it would make our fishermen richer but my main reasons regarding fishing was on conservation. Currently the CFP policy is still applied and day after day our seas are destroyed by our fishing
As far as I’m aware no rules or standards favoured Germany. The German manufacturing success was production of quality products as evidenced by the legendary panel fit of German cars and virtual indestructibility of Miele products.

Living in one of the Cinq Ports I personally know a few fishermen and they believed the frankly ridiculous Brexit claims that losing unfettered access to their biggest market would make them richer. I told them to look at the regulations pertaining to third countries and they said it wouldn’t apply to them. They have a different perspective now.

Conservation is important. The UK set up marine reserves but never really undertook any enforcement. The recent Greenpeace action off Brighton to protect on such designated area has angered our post Brexit government who still want to allow beam trawling of the area. So it seems that leaving may not conserve stocks. The rising sea temperatures have resulted in the main Cod shoals not venturing as far south as they used to so It’s unlikely I’ll catch another 29lb cod fro Dungeness as I did in 1988 but we are seeing other species becoming more prevalent. In 1989, one year after catching my best ever Cod I caught a Trigger fish off Chesil Beach. Had no idea what it was at the time but it was an indication our waters were warming. On that note I believe climate change and micro plastics are the two biggest threats to our flora and fauna of both land and sea but hold little hope that anything substantive will be done about it until it’s too late.
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11-04-2021, 08:32 AM
34

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Hi

Boris went for a Hard Brexit, with a minimal Trade Deal which favoured the EU.

We insisted on taking back control, with closed Borders with the Continental EU.

We cannot pick and choose, that also meant a Hard Border in Northern Ireland.

We cannot pick and choose, it was our choice.
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11-04-2021, 09:02 AM
35

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
As far as I’m aware no rules or standards favoured Germany. The German manufacturing success was production of quality products as evidenced by the legendary panel fit of German cars and virtual indestructibility of Miele products.

Living in one of the Cinq Ports I personally know a few fishermen and they believed the frankly ridiculous Brexit claims that losing unfettered access to their biggest market would make them richer. I told them to look at the regulations pertaining to third countries and they said it wouldn’t apply to them. They have a different perspective now.

Conservation is important. The UK set up marine reserves but never really undertook any enforcement. The recent Greenpeace action off Brighton to protect on such designated area has angered our post Brexit government who still want to allow beam trawling of the area. So it seems that leaving may not conserve stocks. The rising sea temperatures have resulted in the main Cod shoals not venturing as far south as they used to so It’s unlikely I’ll catch another 29lb cod fro Dungeness as I did in 1988 but we are seeing other species becoming more prevalent. In 1989, one year after catching my best ever Cod I caught a Trigger fish off Chesil Beach. Had no idea what it was at the time but it was an indication our waters were warming. On that note I believe climate change and micro plastics are the two biggest threats to our flora and fauna of both land and sea but hold little hope that anything substantive will be done about it until it’s too late.
You should familiarise yourself with the UK fisheries act, zonal attachment and species quotas.

Im not explaining all this again.

The biggest threat to our climate is overfishing. The seas and oceans captured 1000s x more carbon than rain forests and when the fish decline so does all marine life including that plants which act as a massive carbon sink.

Watch the documentary "Seaspiracy," for just how serious this is.
Banchory
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11-04-2021, 09:36 AM
36

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
You should familiarise yourself with the UK fisheries act, zonal attachment and species quotas.

Im not explaining all this again.

The biggest threat to our climate is overfishing. The seas and oceans captured 1000s x more carbon than rain forests and when the fish decline so does all marine life including that plants which act as a massive carbon sink.

Watch the documentary "Seaspiracy," for just how serious this is.
Quotas become irrelevant if you cut yourself off from your main market because business will fail long before sufficient new markets are found

Industrial and agricultural carbon output is the biggest threat as its immediate effect on the natural balance far outweighs any impact of reduced fish stocks

But you could do your bit and stop fishing
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11-04-2021, 11:15 AM
37

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
Quotas become irrelevant if you cut yourself off from your main market because business will fail long before sufficient new markets are found

Industrial and agricultural carbon output is the biggest threat as its immediate effect on the natural balance far outweighs any impact of reduced fish stocks

But you could do your bit and stop fishing

Wrong!

Do you think the EU dictate what people in the 27 member states eat as part if their staple diet ?

Dream on.

The UK should provide quotas that favour the UK fleet not the EU for a start then we would not need to import fish and provide for our domestic market without buying in cod, herring sol etc from abroad.

The only reason government's are targeting businesses for CO2 emissions is because of the opportunity of stealth taxes. The sea covers 80% of the UK and its climate acts as the biggest carbon sink on the planet. When fish decline the plantation declines too and less carbon is absorbed. If we sorted our oceans out then we would sort out the climate change issue and the plastic pollution problems in our seas at the same time, eradicating micro plastic beads over time ad well. This is also catastrophic to marine life.

Industrial fishing is not sustainable with the huge supetrawlers and the system of discards which favours throwing thousands of tons of dead fish overboard in favour of more expensive species that can be caught and landed. We simply must get rid of this stupidity and replace it with fishing methods that allow sustainability and massive increase of marine conservation zones and massive fines and impounding of boats that breach it. We also need fishing seasons and a licensing system based on number of days at sea.

Do my bit and stop fishing ? I practise catch and release for all fish all fish under the MLS rules and take only what I would eat. Nothing more - rod and line is the most sustainable method for fishing. MCZs are already set up/proposed where it is illegal for sea anglers to fish and I know for a fact Southwold Pier is policed for anglers catching and killing undersized fish. We need more of this.
Banchory
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11-04-2021, 01:35 PM
38

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Wrong!

Do you think the EU dictate what people in the 27 member states eat as part if their staple diet ?

Dream on.

The UK should provide quotas that favour the UK fleet not the EU for a start then we would not need to import fish and provide for our domestic market without buying in cod, herring sol etc from abroad.
You seem to be confused as I never inferred the EU dictate anything. I merely stated that the main customer of our fishermen are in the EU and by leaving the EU our fishermen are now subject to all the non tariff barriers applicable to third countries that were in place when we were in the EU which has made exporting fish to the EU either less profitable or unviable. Already our fishing boats are landing their catch in the EU at extra cost of fuel and time just to be viable. This in turn reduces the tax revenue the U.K. would receive from exports. Shellfish exporters have effectively lost their markets unless they invest in cleansing tanks and the cost of Veterinary certificates is unviable for small scale exporters

We could have all the quotas for the fish we like to eat but that may not be sufficient for our needs as rising sea temperatures mean that the main shoals of Cod & Haddock spend less time in our waters.

The key issue is that fishermen have been sold a pup and the time and cost it will take them to adapt to be compliant with EU regulations for third countries my prove to be too much for them to weather
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11-04-2021, 01:55 PM
39

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Bread ->
Wrong!

Do you think the EU dictate what people in the 27 member states eat as part if their staple diet ?

Dream on.

The UK should provide quotas that favour the UK fleet not the EU for a start then we would not need to import fish and provide for our domestic market without buying in cod, herring sol etc from abroad.

The only reason government's are targeting businesses for CO2 emissions is because of the opportunity of stealth taxes. The sea covers 80% of the UK and its climate acts as the biggest carbon sink on the planet. When fish decline the plantation declines too and less carbon is absorbed. If we sorted our oceans out then we would sort out the climate change issue and the plastic pollution problems in our seas at the same time, eradicating micro plastic beads over time ad well. This is also catastrophic to marine life.

Industrial fishing is not sustainable with the huge supetrawlers and the system of discards which favours throwing thousands of tons of dead fish overboard in favour of more expensive species that can be caught and landed. We simply must get rid of this stupidity and replace it with fishing methods that allow sustainability and massive increase of marine conservation zones and massive fines and impounding of boats that breach it. We also need fishing seasons and a licensing system based on number of days at sea.

Do my bit and stop fishing ? I practise catch and release for all fish all fish under the MLS rules and take only what I would eat. Nothing more - rod and line is the most sustainable method for fishing. MCZs are already set up/proposed where it is illegal for sea anglers to fish and I know for a fact Southwold Pier is policed for anglers catching and killing undersized fish. We need more of this.
If the UK was able to dictate the species of fish eaten in the UK, quota would be superfluous.

Sunlight doesn't penetrate deep enough for plantation in sea. What you probably refer to is plankton, food for fish and kryl. Less fish, more plankton, more carbondioxide is captured.

Please keep fishing, it is harmless and keeps you from misschieve on here!
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11-04-2021, 01:56 PM
40

Re: Article 10 NI protocol

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
You seem to be confused as I never inferred the EU dictate anything. I merely stated that the main customer of our fishermen are in the EU and by leaving the EU our fishermen are now subject to all the non tariff barriers applicable to third countries that were in place when we were in the EU which has made exporting fish to the EU either less profitable or unviable. Already our fishing boats are landing their catch in the EU at extra cost of fuel and time just to be viable. This in turn reduces the tax revenue the U.K. would receive from exports. Shellfish exporters have effectively lost their markets unless they invest in cleansing tanks and the cost of Veterinary certificates is unviable for small scale exporters

We could have all the quotas for the fish we like to eat but that may not be sufficient for our needs as rising sea temperatures mean that the main shoals of Cod & Haddock spend less time in our waters.

The key issue is that fishermen have been sold a pup and the time and cost it will take them to adapt to be compliant with EU regulations for third countries my prove to be too much for them to weather
If the EU want to stop our fish imports the people will be outraged. There is a big difference in public opinion in the EU compared to the Commission.

Fish prices in the UK are so high (higher than steak per Kg) because of species quotas. Importing our fish stocks from other countries makes no sense at all.

Rising sea temperatures is also very debatable. Look at the rise in populations of polar bears etc. The biggest threat to fishing is over -fishing not big corporations (unless they are linked to industrial fishing)

Tuna have returned to UK waters too - we used to fish tuna off the North East Coast in the 1940s. The reason fish is so expensive is because their numbers have been decimated since the CFP came into force.

The seas absorb about 4000 times the amount of CO2 than the rainforest. If we destroy the capability of the seas then we speed up climate change dramatically ... taxing big corporations only favour anti capitalist movements and makes people unemployed, moves manufacturing to countries who have the biggest CO2 emissions and stifles economies. Co2 emissions just move to other countries.

A robust fisheries policy based on conservation and sustainability is what's needed. In our EEZ and territorial waters our fisheries act is the only law and all vessels fishing our natural resource need to comply with it or be prosecuted.

No excuses and zero tolerance.

If we need to we can subsidise our fleet to make change happen quicker- outside the EU this is now possible.
 
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