Join for free
Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >
MickB's Avatar
MickB
Senior Member
MickB is offline
London UK
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,986
MickB is male  MickB has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 04:42 PM
11

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

I think that, despite their recent successes they are many years from power (if they ever get there). To achieve power they would have to make some serious decisions about where they stand on a whole range of issues and policies. At the moment, their anti-EU stance attracts votes from both right wing voters and those, like me, on the left who have been opposed to membership of the "European project" since its inception (as was the Labour Party prior to Harold Wilson's leadership). The reality is that all those votes, whether from right or left are protest votes, not made with any serious intention of voting in a UKIP government. If one or more of the main parties doesn't change course to better reflect the wishes of the electorate over the next few years, then maybe we could start talking about UKIP gaining power.
stevmk2's Avatar
stevmk2
Senior Member
stevmk2 is offline
Milton Keynes
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 3,324
stevmk2 is male  stevmk2 has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 05:37 PM
12

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by MickB ->
I think that, despite their recent successes they are many years from power (if they ever get there). To achieve power they would have to make some serious decisions about where they stand on a whole range of issues and policies. At the moment, their anti-EU stance attracts votes from both right wing voters and those, like me, on the left who have been opposed to membership of the "European project" since its inception (as was the Labour Party prior to Harold Wilson's leadership). The reality is that all those votes, whether from right or left are protest votes, not made with any serious intention of voting in a UKIP government. If one or more of the main parties doesn't change course to better reflect the wishes of the electorate over the next few years, then maybe we could start talking about UKIP gaining power.
Problem is though, how long do we leave it?

When we were going through the PCC Elections I had a series of email "conversations" with the UKIP hopeful and his thoughts were much like mine.

It seems that many party activists in UKIP despair at times at the attitude of Nigel Farage and the upper echelons of the party because, he told me, many activists feel that the support is ready and waiting but people still think that UKIP is a "hobby" party and not really focussed on the whole political scene.

It's really something the Farage needs to get a grip on if he really wants to try for a future government with UKIP taking a major role then a UKIP Government, if that's possible.

At the moment we're stuck between Labour, Conservatives and the Lib Dem Also-Rans in my opinion.

Surely we cannot go the same way as the US with Republican OR Democrat - and that's it!!

Jeeeeez, if only people would get up off their A****s and vote for a change!!! stevmk2
Uncle Joe
Chatterbox
Uncle Joe is offline
Brighton UK
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 25,458
Uncle Joe is male  Uncle Joe has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 09:39 PM
13

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by stevmk2 ->
Problem is though, how long do we leave it?

When we were going through the PCC Elections I had a series of email "conversations" with the UKIP hopeful and his thoughts were much like mine.

It seems that many party activists in UKIP despair at times at the attitude of Nigel Farage and the upper echelons of the party because, he told me, many activists feel that the support is ready and waiting but people still think that UKIP is a "hobby" party and not really focussed on the whole political scene.

It's really something the Farage needs to get a grip on if he really wants to try for a future government with UKIP taking a major role then a UKIP Government, if that's possible.

At the moment we're stuck between Labour, Conservatives and the Lib Dem Also-Rans in my opinion.

Surely we cannot go the same way as the US with Republican OR Democrat - and that's it!!

Jeeeeez, if only people would get up off their A****s and vote for a change!!! stevmk2

Steve matey, its no use merely swopping one set of politicians for a different set of the same. What is needed is a root and branch reform of the SYSTEM of government. To start with, complete abolition of the House of Lords and replaced with a fully elected second chamber. Cut the financial ties with the 'established' church so that Mrs Windsor can no longer claim to be head of the church of england, in fact, abolish the post of monarch entirely and replace with a directly elected 'President'. A total ban on any MP having another job too.

There are many more policies I could advocate here, but the few above are sufficient to get started.
Michael's Avatar
Michael
Senior Member
Michael is offline
Near London,UK
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 758
Michael is male  Michael has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 10:09 PM
14

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

I believe this viral message started in Australia in 2010/2011? Supposedly written by a Jenny Bell.

It has wandered around the internet ever since and this is the latest offering addressed to our politicians..
ben-varrey's Avatar
ben-varrey
Chatterbox
ben-varrey is offline
UK
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,662
ben-varrey is female  ben-varrey has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 11:08 PM
15

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by MickB ->
My next door neighbour is of Pakistani origin and he runs his own building company (from his council house which goes against our local authority's regulations but that's another story). When he first moved in about 12 years ago, all his workers were Sikhs as he claimed they were both cheaper than native English workers and more conscientious. Now, everyone he employs are Eastern Europeans - mostly Albanians and Kossovans - as although he likes the Polish work ethic, they are (for him) too expensive.

I don't blame immigrants for wanting to come to the UK - given the economies they are coming from it makes perfect sense for them. I blame successive governments, particularly Blair's Labour government for running an Open Door policy on immigration. In my part of London, indigenous English people are now very much in the minority - something which will accelerate rapidly over the next few years as the immigrant communities with Islamic cultures are having more children per family than are the indigenous white community or the more long standing black and asian communities. Some of our secondary schools now have well over 80% Asian pupils.

To be worried about this situation is not racist, it is completely natural. Our country has been changed out of all recognition by successive political regimes - and we have never been given the opportunity to have a say about it. At least UKIP, despite their massive shortcomings, are now giving the British people an opportunity to stick two fingers up at the political establishment and say loudly, "WE AIN'T HAPPY!"
Well Mick, I can be a cynical old so and so at times and I said many years ago that I felt part of cheap labour coming in was, in part, to drive down wages/salaries in Britain. I understand that pay is what drives prices up and the British labour just makes our good uncompetitive, I get all that but it's all happened too fast but with the cost of living racing ahead. In my humble opinion, both Labour and Conservative are usig Draconian measures (much like the Church used to use) to get the population back under control and reliant again.
ben-varrey's Avatar
ben-varrey
Chatterbox
ben-varrey is offline
UK
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,662
ben-varrey is female  ben-varrey has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 11:16 PM
16

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by stevmk2 ->
That's exactly what is needed ben, a change in this daft "traditional" voting in this country.
I don't understand that mentality either Steve - people should vote for policies, not parties; that's why, imo, the UK is stuck with 2 main parties instead of widening the field.

Not quite sure about the second part - "vote in the most loony independents", or are you saying NOT to vote them in?

Perhaps you'd clarify that.
No, I'm saying vote them in. Do you remember when the French voted in their version of the BNP in their by-elections as a warning shot against the French government? That soon got the French government toeing the line again!

I was a Labour supporter for many years but post-Blair / Brown I've no faith in them now and the Conservatives are still showing all the signs of being a party mainly for maintaining the rich, no matter what Mr Cameron himself (a Millionaire!) might personally think.
On the Island, we're lucky not to have Labour v Tory - we vote for people and their policies and those people from the different regions form the government. The downside is the half-baked Chief Minister we've got - wet wool has more spine than he's got.

What galls me though is that I'm perfectly capable of making up my own mind about other political parties but the spin put out by each party's supporters in the media regularly denounce UKIP as a racist party for example, akin to the BNP!
Shows that the big parties are actually worried about losing support to me!! stevmk2
I agree with you, I think they are worried about UKIP. Many people still think they are a branch of the BNP which they're not - it's all spin from what I can see. Given UKIP have black members, I don't understand how or why that myth continues (and they had black members before the courts became involved with BNP).

I think Nigel Farage is much more in touch with ordinary people and maybe that's why they are gravitating towards him - he certainly gives them all a run for their money on Question Time!
ben-varrey's Avatar
ben-varrey
Chatterbox
ben-varrey is offline
UK
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,662
ben-varrey is female  ben-varrey has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 11:23 PM
17

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by stevmk2 ->

It's really something the Farage needs to get a grip on if he really wants to try for a future government with UKIP taking a major role then a UKIP Government, if that's possible.
Maybe Farage knows that his party is still too young to fully take the reins yet. As much I like his policies (well, most of them), I would be wary with them in power yet. The one thing I do like is that I can't imagine, for one moment, that he would allow us to get dragged into wars that are none of our business and neither would he hand over the amount we do to the EU (although Cameron has at least put a dent in the amounts that Brown agreed to - the idiot; no small wonder he is the most detested PM Britain has ever had).
ben-varrey's Avatar
ben-varrey
Chatterbox
ben-varrey is offline
UK
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,662
ben-varrey is female  ben-varrey has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 11:24 PM
18

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by Michael ->
I believe this viral message started in Australia in 2010/2011? Supposedly written by a Jenny Bell.

It has wandered around the internet ever since and this is the latest offering addressed to our politicians..
What message?
Bruce's Avatar
Bruce
Chatterbox
Bruce is offline
Wollongong, Australia
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 15,218
Bruce is male  Bruce has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
01-03-2013, 11:38 PM
19

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by MickB ->

I don't blame immigrants for wanting to come to the UK - given the economies they are coming from it makes perfect sense for them. I blame successive governments, particularly Blair's Labour government for running an Open Door policy on immigration. In my part of London, indigenous English people are now very much in the minority -
How absurd! The indigenous inhabitants were swamped by the Norse, Angles, Saxons and Normans centuries ago. Far too late to say they are a minority now.

Britain is a member of the EU. Doesn't the EU require free travel and the ability to live and work in other EU countries? No good blaming politicians for obeying the rules of the organisation Briton's voted to join in 1975. (I was living there then and voted 'NON' but the majority voted 'QUI' so it's no good complaining about it now)

Remember 'Auf Weidersein Pet'? no one complained then about pommie builders working in Germany.


Originally Posted by MickB ->
To be worried about this situation is not racist, it is completely natural. Our country has been changed out of all recognition by successive political regimes - "
No, you are right it is not racism it is Xenophobia. A difference people seem unable to grasp.

As for voting... Umm, Britain becoming a democracy would be a start. Then scrapping the first past the post voting and making voting compulsory. That way you get the government you deserve.
stevmk2's Avatar
stevmk2
Senior Member
stevmk2 is offline
Milton Keynes
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 3,324
stevmk2 is male  stevmk2 has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
02-03-2013, 06:14 PM
20

Re: A letter to David "CONMAN" Cameron "You worry me"

Originally Posted by Bruce ->
No, you are right it is not racism it is Xenophobia. A difference people seem unable to grasp.A
I could go for xenophobia Bruce if you refer to the term as meaning a FEAR of foreigners perhaps but certainly not a hatred.

I believe that the percentage of British residents who actually hate foreigners is very small these days and I've never really met anyone who openly professed to hating any immigrants, foreigners or whatever name you care to choose these days.

We are resilient people in this country because we've had to be over the centuries.

OK, there might be the odd moments here and there where you could call events as racist protests but that's ebbing away now.

Take a walk down a town High Street almost anywhere now and the racial mix is accepted by most British residents in my opinion but there is staunch opposition now to economic migrants because that impinges on everyone already living in this country who sees a threat to their own lives or to the lives of their children in terms of future jobs or careers, housing etcetera, etcetera.

Calling that racist or xenophobic is misrepresenting the truth I think. stevmk2
 
Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >

Thread Tools


© Copyright 2009, Over50sForum   Contact Us | Over 50s Forum! | Archive | Privacy Statement | Terms of Use | Top

Powered by vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.