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Norbert
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14-01-2019, 06:02 PM
1

A German Point Of View

Today I just want to tell some british people using this forum that I would love to have Great Britain continueing in the EU.Not primary because GB is like Germany a net contributor. Allthough that matters as well. We pay for a good thing!

It's primary because GB represented positions not far away from ours and some more nations in the middle and north of the EU. So I think we loose an important partner in the contest of different interests within the EU. Nations with different interests become stronger, we become weaker - without you. That's a pity. And it's primary because I think that we all need a strong united Europe, otherwise we all will end as a matchfield of the United States and China one day, having no power to oppose the if necessary. I don't mention Russia because I think Russia should finally be a part of the European House as well.

I don't think that GB will have advantages outside the EU. You may be able to reduce the number of immigrants. But that is something more and more wanted in other European Nations as well, even here in Germany. I think we should always help people that are in danger somwhere, maybe by giving them a new life in Europe. But we should try to keep other immigrants outside. Oh, I wish anyone a good economical situation. But we can't realize that for millions and other millions here in the EU. Their home countries must find a way to realize a better life for their people at home. And we should help them with that. I think that many british people voted for Brexit because of the immigrants. But we all have to face this problem and together we should find a way to solve it.

I don't think you will have a financial advantage outside the EU. You safe your net payments. But a reduced british economy will make you loose more than that. And you will have a reduced economy. The European Unions brings the best economy possible to its members and there will be no way to have the same alone. GB will never be another Sitzerland.

But an even bigger problem for GB will be the inner turmoil because only a small majority voted for the Brexit. And some local majorites against the Brexit will feel repressed in future. This is extrem in Scotia where a big majority voted against the Brexit. So the scotish people will feel repressed. The people of Northern Ireland. The people of London. You risk new violance in Ireland.

And: The not so intelligent people repress the more intelligent ones. Stupid thing, well this seems to be a not so nice aspect of Democracy somehow. And most important: Your older people repress your younger people. But the future is owned by the youth! The youth is connected with the world and more european. They grew up with the Interent. And they will not change. By the way: That's the reason why GB will leave the EU only for 10 years or 20 years at maximum. Then the older and more national orientated british people will be a minority and GB will come back anyway. But if GB can leave the EU only for a short time, why all the efforts and risks for just some years?

I am German, I live in Berlin. My nation caused a horrible war because of Nationalism. My home town was destroyed before I was born, but in my own youth I saw some rests of that. I am not totaly against nationalism, but it must be on a low level. Nationalism today should just say: Let's keep our home well and safe. But not more than this. No aggression. No isolation. No self-aggrandizement.

And maybe a new way of soft nationalism could grow: A common European nationalism with which we don't think "We, the British", or "We, the Germans" or spanish, italian and so far. One day it should be "We, the Europeans". Peaceful, succesful and strong togehther.

Germany has a special history very comparable to this. Maybe you don't know that Germany before 1870/71 was fragmented into many, many bigger and smaller little states. I think more than the european nations today. And it was not easy to unite them to Germany. There where many arguments and interests against that. But Germany was founded in those years and it was very, very successful then. Germany united had great years - until the wars began.

The whole world can learn two major lessons from German history:

1. Unification is good and brings success and prosperity.
2. Isolation and war is bad and brings destruction and poverty.

Do not look back. Look and go forward. Let us stay united. And let us be more united than ever before in 10 years.
TessA
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14-01-2019, 06:09 PM
2

Re: A German Point Of View

It's interesting to read other European views on this subject.
I doubt if many on here will agree with you though.
I hope you're not put off posting by some opinions, we should all be able to say what we think.
marmaduke
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14-01-2019, 06:57 PM
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Re: A German Point Of View

What a warped view ...

But an even bigger problem for GB will be the inner turmoil because only a small majority voted for the Brexit. And some local majorites against the Brexit will feel repressed in future. This is extrem in Scotia where a big majority voted against the Brexit. So the scotish people will feel repressed. The people of Northern Ireland. The people of London. You risk new violance in Ireland.



Firstly Scotland was given a referendum and voted to stay in the uk ... secondly the entire population of Scotland is that of let’s say birminghamistan ...so your suggesting we should stop brexit for a few million ? As for when you start to go on about intelligence well you now insult mine and every other forward thinking leaver as to leave your sad sorry state called the EU is FOREVER .... to give you a rough idea how long FOREVER is may I suggest you start a timer now and return here to this forum in maybe 100 years time , by then you may see even had we left with no deal hard Brexit ( I wish !) and had a few years financial turmoil that FOREVER is still a very long way off and we not you will be an independent nation , that means a nation where our vote counts , were our political elite will indeed work for the electorate whilst you are still voting for Angela or whoever but in reality are still finding the EU say what your actually going to do so whilst talking intelligence I suggest you return with some if wishing to tell me why to be a member of your silly club in order to buy a Porsche I must open my door to 500 million Europeans all eager to work here and cut wages ....
talking of this reminds to read your German fortune as mystic marmaduke foresees many many polish heading for Germany when we leave and we will soon see germexit as we won’t be the last to leave your beloved corrupt union but we may well offer you a deal when you are free of the eu’s strings .... see you on the dark side my friend as FOREVER lasts longer than a few tough years brexit.

And as for the Irish problem .... we don’t want a border ... we won’t have a border .... THE EU HOWEVER IS THE ONE NEEDING A BORDER ... SO YOU BUILD IT AND PATROL IT !!!
realspeed
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14-01-2019, 07:22 PM
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Re: A German Point Of View

The European union are worried about the financial loss when we leave. The other members are to cough up more to makeup the shortfall.. We fought 2 world wars for our freedom not to have it snatched by devious means by foreigners
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14-01-2019, 08:03 PM
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Re: A German Point Of View

Originally Posted by realspeed ->
The European union are worried about the financial loss when we leave. The other members are to cough up more to makeup the shortfall.. We fought 2 world wars for our freedom not to have it snatched by devious means by foreigners
Oh Realspeed!! your attitude makes me want to weep.
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14-01-2019, 08:05 PM
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Re: A German Point Of View

You make a very thoughtful and insightful post Norbert. I tend to agree with your views. (Stands back and waits for the vitriol to fly).
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14-01-2019, 08:15 PM
7

Re: A German Point Of View

Thank you for you post Norbet and for what sounds like genuine concern. I hope I can speak for most 'leave' voters when I say that we British do not have a problem with the people of Europe (despite some of the banter you might read) but with the idiots in charge who meddle in our affairs and give us what we see as a bad deal.

You are probably correct in that leaving the EU is now going to make things difficult for us but that has come about by those who could not accept the democratic vote, not our decision to leave.
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14-01-2019, 08:24 PM
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Re: A German Point Of View

Originally Posted by longdogs ->
thank you for you post norbet and for what sounds like genuine concern. I hope i can speak for most 'leave' voters when i say that we british do not have a problem with the people of europe (despite some of the banter you might read) but with the idiots in charge who meddle in our affairs and give us what we see as a bad deal.

You are probably correct in that leaving the eu is now going to make things difficult for us but that has come about by those who could not accept the democratic vote, not our decision to leave.
TessA
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14-01-2019, 08:38 PM
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Re: A German Point Of View

Originally Posted by Longdogs ->
Thank you for you post Norbet and for what sounds like genuine concern. I hope I can speak for most 'leave' voters when I say that we British do not have a problem with the people of Europe (despite some of the banter you might read) but with the idiots in charge who meddle in our affairs and give us what we see as a bad deal.

You are probably correct in that leaving the EU is now going to make things difficult for us but that has come about by those who could not accept the democratic vote, not our decision to leave.
Good reply LD, you are a gentleman.
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14-01-2019, 08:40 PM
10

Re: A German Point Of View

Originally Posted by Norbert ->
I think that many british people voted for Brexit because of the immigrants.
Well you 'think' wrong in my case, I voted not to remain in the Common Market in 1975 long before immigration became an issue.

I have my own reasons for wishing to leave the EU based on years of watching the absurdity of how it functions and having to pay towards supporting 'two master', our own parliament and the EU.

I am sick of the doom-mongers telling us how bad things will be when we leave . No one knows for sure what it will be like for us initially but I know the UK has the expertise to prosper and have a better future outside the EU.
I do not expect everything to go smoothly and there will be teething troubles but there isn't anything we can't overcome in time.


Norbert I see a party is Germany is going to campaign to leave the EU...
''AfD party votes to campaign for German exit from EU''

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...european-union

Maybe you would be better focusing your energies on them, we have already voted to leave and will do so on March 29th

ETA an example of the absurdity of the EU and how it wastes our money...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ng-circus.html
 
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