Join for free
Page 11 of 27 « First < 9 10 11 12 13 21 > Last »
Primus1's Avatar
Primus1
Senior Member
Primus1 is offline
York
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 4,648
Primus1 is male  Primus1 has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 07:28 AM
101

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
Stalin's gulags were part of WWII as well. Red army soldiers captured as POWs by the Germans ended up there if they were not shot as spies on return to the USSR. Britain repatriated Russian soldiers back to Stalin's hands after the war. Not sure how many survived.
Don’t forget the German POW,s captured by the Russians, many didn’t return until the early/mid fifties, if they returned at all..
Dachs
Senior Member
Dachs is offline
Germany
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 224
Dachs is male  Dachs has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 08:23 AM
102

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by JBR ->
I agree. I have always regarded that as rather one-sided and never understood their decision.
It's understandable if the main reason for that is added and that was " to support free peoples who are resisting attempted subjugation by armed minorities or by outside pressures” as stated in the Truman Doctrine. IOW, apart form economic considerations the USA had a vested interest in preventing the expansion of Soviet totalitarianism into large parts of Western and Southern Europe.
It should also be mentioned that not just West Germany but a number of other European countries ( 17) benefited from the European Recovery Programme which was also largely in the form of credits and the supply of foods and raw materials, i.e. repayable.
big ben's Avatar
big ben
Senior Member
big ben is offline
United Kingdom
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 922
big ben is male  big ben has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 08:43 AM
103

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by The Artful Todger ->
Err, not entirely. Stalin and the Soviet government was facing internal revolution. What was done had to be done.
Say what you will but Stalin was a bigger criminal than Hitler. He was responsible for a far bigger crime against his own people than Hitler ever was against the Jews.
The Artful Todger's Avatar
The Artful Todger
Chatterbox
The Artful Todger is offline
Suffolk UK
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 12,816
The Artful Todger is male  The Artful Todger has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 10:53 AM
104

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by big ben ->
Say what you will but Stalin was a bigger criminal than Hitler. He was responsible for a far bigger crime against his own people than Hitler ever was against the Jews.
I disagree. Joe Stalin was facing the attempts funded and supported from outside to overthrow the Russian Revolution. Check out "White Russians". On top of that the war in Europe was raging.

His "own people" were NOT his own people. The people who fell foul were counter-revolutionary forces who were attacking the free Russians with just as much ferocity and so had to either join the free russian people or face the consequences. Their decision.
Donkeyman
Chatterbox
Donkeyman is offline
Melton,United Kingdom
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 9,088
Donkeyman is male  Donkeyman has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 11:54 AM
105

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by AnnieS ->
Isn't this fun! We need a history forum
Jus thinking the same Annie?
And no nasty innuendos either?
Very refreshing! imo of course !!

Donkeyman! 👍🤗🤗🤗👍
Donkeyman
Chatterbox
Donkeyman is offline
Melton,United Kingdom
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 9,088
Donkeyman is male  Donkeyman has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 12:21 PM
106

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by Dachs ->
It's understandable if the main reason for that is added and that was " to support free peoples who are resisting attempted subjugation by armed minorities or by outside pressures” as stated in the Truman Doctrine. IOW, apart form economic considerations the USA had a vested interest in preventing the expansion of Soviet totalitarianism into large parts of Western and Southern Europe.
It should also be mentioned that not just West Germany but a number of other European countries ( 17) benefited from the European Recovery Programme which was also largely in the form of credits and the supply of foods and raw materials, i.e. repayable.
Is there any documentation available Dachs that shows Germany
and other European powers ever paid these debts?? And Russia
also received vast amounts of aid from USA !! Did it ever get
repaid ??
Your info about the Truman doctrine is very interesting to me as
it confirms my views as to why America acted as it did post war !!
So thanks for posting that !!

Donkeyman! 👍🤔🤔👍
Dachs
Senior Member
Dachs is offline
Germany
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 224
Dachs is male  Dachs has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 01:26 PM
107

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by Donkeyman ->
Is there any documentation available Dachs that shows Germany
[...]ever paid these debts??

Donkeyman! 👍🤔🤔👍
Those US-$320 bn of war reparations which Germany was to pay originally in total proved to be non-repayable. Again, due to the Truman doctrine, they were gradually lowered to roughly $17 bn. (see top three bars in bar chart). In total, Germany has paid war reparations of something like US-$38 bn by 2000.
From Marshall plan funds, in particular, West Germany had received loans to the tune of $1.4 bn of which US-$ 1 bn were repaid as stipulated by the London Agreement on German External Debts.
https://de.statista.com/statistik/da...ten-weltkrieg/
Donkeyman
Chatterbox
Donkeyman is offline
Melton,United Kingdom
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 9,088
Donkeyman is male  Donkeyman has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 03:38 PM
108

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by Dachs ->
Those US-$320 bn of war reparations which Germany was to pay originally in total proved to be non-repayable. Again, due to the Truman doctrine, they were gradually lowered to roughly $17 bn. (see top three bars in bar chart). In total, Germany has paid war reparations of something like US-$38 bn by 2000.
From Marshall plan funds, in particular, West Germany had received loans to the tune of $1.4 bn of which US-$ 1 bn were repaid as stipulated by the London Agreement on German External Debts.
https://de.statista.com/statistik/da...ten-weltkrieg/
So it seems that Germany has paid of a small portion of the costs
of the war to USA then Dachs, at least that's something l suppose?However , UK borrowed, in materials and arms etc from the US and
Canada a total of. £2•8 billion of which we repaid £4•8 billion over
50 years, so almost double what we borrowed ??
The amounts sound trifling now don't they!!
What l have been unable to ascertain though is if the axis countries
ever made reparations to UK ??
And don't forget that USA and UK kept large standing armies in
Germany for many years ostensibly to hold back the communist
hordes ?? Who financed that?
And don't forget the Berlin blockade when all supplies into Berlin
had to be airlifted in? Who paid for that!??
Imo it should have been USA, and they may well have done so?
But l have no info on this !!
Thanks for your links !!
Donkeyman! 🤔🤔
The Artful Todger's Avatar
The Artful Todger
Chatterbox
The Artful Todger is offline
Suffolk UK
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 12,816
The Artful Todger is male  The Artful Todger has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 04:16 PM
109

Re: World War II

Originally Posted by Donkeyman ->
So it seems that Germany has paid of a small portion of the costs
of the war to USA then Dachs, at least that's something l suppose?However , UK borrowed, in materials and arms etc from the US and
Canada a total of. £2•8 billion of which we repaid £4•8 billion over
50 years, so almost double what we borrowed ??
The amounts sound trifling now don't they!!
What l have been unable to ascertain though is if the axis countries
ever made reparations to UK ??
And don't forget that USA and UK kept large standing armies in
Germany for many years ostensibly to hold back the communist
hordes ?? Who financed that?
And don't forget the Berlin blockade when all supplies into Berlin
had to be airlifted in? Who paid for that!??
Imo it should have been USA, and they may well have done so?
But l have no info on this !!
Thanks for your links !!
Donkeyman! 🤔🤔

The UK declared war on Germany. In any case why should Germany pay for foreign forces on German soil? Berlin airlift? If any nation should pay then the USSR. Not Germany.
Dachs
Senior Member
Dachs is offline
Germany
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 224
Dachs is male  Dachs has posted at least 25 times and has been a member for 3 months or more 
 
09-04-2021, 04:47 PM
110

Re: World War II

@Donkeyman wrote:
So it seems that Germany has paid of a small portion of the costs of the war to USA then Dachs, at least that's something l suppose?However , UK borrowed, in materials and arms etc from the US and Canada a total of. £2•8 billion of which we repaid £4•8 billion over 50 years, so almost double what we borrowed ??

That's something that should have been negotiated with the US and Canada.
The amounts sound trifling now don't they!!What l have been unable to ascertain though is if the axis countries ever made reparations to UK ??
"According to the Yalta Conference, no reparations to Allied countries would be paid in money. Instead much of the value transferred consisted of German industrial assets as well as forced labour to the Allies.[2] The Allied demands were further outlined during the Potsdam Conference. Reparations were to be directly paid to the four victor powers (France, Britain, USA and the Soviet Union); for the countries in the Soviet sphere of influence, the Soviet Union would determine its distribution." [...]
At the beginning of the occupation, the Allies dismantled the remnants of German industries. Plants and machinery were dismantled, the railroad system deconstructed and everything transported to the Allies. The German merchant fleet and all other ships were handed over. Foreign stocks of about 2.5 billion dollars were confiscated. The remaining German industries had to give up a share of their production to the Allies. Large shipments of steel, coal, but also other industrial production were seized and transported out of the country.[4] Later the Western Allies softened their stance in favour of the Marshall Plan, while Eastern Germany continued to deliver industrial goods and raw materials to the Soviet Union until 1953.[5]" [...]
Millions of Germans were pressed into forced labour for several years to work for the Allies in camps, mining, harvesting or industry. "

And don't forget that USA and UK kept large standing armies in Germany for many years ostensibly to hold back the communist hordes ?? Who financed that?

"After World War II ended, the main four Allied powers – Great Britain, The United States, France, and the Soviet Union – jointly occupied Germany, with the Allied occupation officially ending in the 1950s. During this time, Germany was held accountable for the Allied occupation’s expenses, amounting to over several billion dollars."

And don't forget the Berlin blockade when all supplies into Berlin had to be airlifted in? Who paid for that!?? Imo it should have been USA, and they may well have done so? But l have no info on this !!

The costs of the airlift were initially paid for by the US and Britain (US-$ 200 million), later on by the Germans. In Nov 1948 the three western occupied zones (later on the FRG) raised a special tax "Notopfer Berlin" which was in effect until 1958.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_reparations
https://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/t...n/1510134.html
 
Page 11 of 27 « First < 9 10 11 12 13 21 > Last »

Thread Tools


© Copyright 2009, Over50sForum   Contact Us | Over 50s Forum! | Archive | Privacy Statement | Terms of Use | Top

Powered by vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.