13-04-2019, 04:50 PM
105
Re: Flexible extension???
Originally Posted by weedeek
->
This and this again! Bread accuses you of not knowing your history, you can’t change the past but you can learn from it, the E.U. evolved in response to lessons learned from the World Wars. I don’t see how reverting to right wing isolationism can do anyone any good. Keep it going Banchory.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/zero-hedge/
Unfortunately his view of history is now tainted by alternative facts and his understanding of economics seems to mirror that of Patrick Mumford who also advocates leaving without a deal and believes the UK would prosper, a view not shared by most economists. I know who’s view I’d trust
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.e...-one-disagrees
13-04-2019, 05:12 PM
106
Re: Flexible extension???
HiThere is a very important principle at stake here, far bigger than Brexit itself.
We were given a Referendum and told by both Conservative and Labour that they would honour the result.
We voted Leave, the little people, the ordinary ones.
This is a huge principle, one person, one vote, all votes being equal.
I voted Leave, but if the result had been Remain, I would have accepted it and moved on.
That is democracy for you, a nation of equals.
We are not serfs to be dictated to by our Barons, those days are long gone, or should be.
The modern equivalent of the Medieval Barons are our Political Elite.
We simply cannot allow ourselves to be dictated to by them.
I accept that Brexit is now going to be a disaster, it had no need to be, but the scale of incompetence of our Politicians is mind blowing.
They have been outmanoeuvred by an aging drunkard.
The best we could come up with was Theresa May, a control freak with no strategy and no commonsense.
She could not even win an Election when she was 20 points ahead and with Corbyn and Abbott on the other side.
Although a total incompetent, she was the best our Political Elite could come up with.
She has outmanoeuvred Boris and JRM, she won the vote of confidence and is safe until December this year.
Short of a General Election, which could well let Corbyn and Abbott in, she is invulnerable.
It is a nightmare, we deserve better.
13-04-2019, 08:51 PM
107
Re: Flexible extension???
Originally Posted by swimfeeders
->
HiThere is a very important principle at stake here, far bigger than Brexit itself.
We were given a Referendum and told by both Conservative and Labour that they would honour the result.
We are governed by Parliament, not by referenda - even Margaret bloody Thatcher (spit) said that.
MPs are representatives, not delegates - another Tory, Edmund Burke, said that.
If MPs feel, as a majority do, that Brexit would damage their constituents, and, on a wider scale, the UK as a whole, then they are entitled - nay, duty-bound - to vote accordingly. And if that entails not rubber-stamping the decision of a referendum, then so be it. And, yes, that may well mean "going back on their word".
MPs are entitled not to honour the result of a referendum if they feel that to honour the result would, on reflection, cause untold suffering and damage. (Or, indeed, for any other reason they may hold).
That, whether you like it or not, is the way that the UK is governed. If you don't like it, then go and live somewhere else.
It's the irony of ironies: the Brexiteers banged on about "taking back control, "British laws for British people", "The sovereignty of the UK Parliament", and so on.
Well - this is what that means. Got it?
No - the Brexiteers still don't get it.
Thank goodness most MPs do.
Do the patriotic thing and be proud of our parliamentary democracy
13-04-2019, 09:01 PM
108
Re: Flexible extension???
Originally Posted by OldFogey
->
That is a moral argument; it is not a legal or constitutional one.We are governed by Parliament, not by referenda - even Margaret bloody Thatcher (spit) said that.
MPs are representatives, not delegates - another Tory, Edmund Burke, said that.
If MPs feel, as a majority do, that Brexit would damage their constituents, and, on a wider scale, the UK as a whole, then they are entitled - nay, duty-bound - to vote accordingly. And if that entails not rubber-stamping the decision of a referendum, then so be it. And, yes, that may well mean "going back on their word".
MPs are entitled not to honour the result of a referendum if they feel that to honour the result would, on reflection, cause untold suffering and damage. (Or, indeed, for any other reason they may hold).
That, whether you like it or not, is the way that the UK is governed. If you don't like it, then go and live somewhere else.
It's the irony of ironies: the Brexiteers banged on about "taking back control, "British laws for British people", "The sovereignty of the UK Parliament", and so on.
Well - this is what that means. Got it?
No - the Brexiteers still don't get it.
Thank goodness most MPs do.
Do the patriotic thing and be proud of our parliamentary democracy
Most of parliament has never had a proper job, done a vat return or paid corporation tax. They haven't a clue about industry or business ... why do they know better than the average Joe?
Because they are an MP ?
Besides if referendums are only advisory and are not legally binding why do you want a second one?
13-04-2019, 09:25 PM
109
Re: Flexible extension???
Originally Posted by Bread
->
Most of parliament has never had a proper job, done a vat return or paid corporation tax. They haven't a clue about industry or business ... why do they know better than the average Joe?Because they are an MP ?
Besides if referendums are only advisory and are not legally binding why do you want a second one?
Second referendum? What is wrong with that?
Why do you think elections are repeated every few years. By leavers logic you do that once every two decades. After an election you give them 20 years to realise their manifesto. Why risk that the next elections overturns the previous choices?
13-04-2019, 09:40 PM
110
Re: Flexible extension???
Originally Posted by Solasch
->
They know better because they are better informed, sometimes confidentially. So yes, they do know better.Second referendum? What is wrong with that?
Why do you think elections are repeated every few years. By leavers logic you do that once every two decades. After an election you give them 20 years to realise their manifesto. Why risk that the next elections overturns the previous choices?
We haven't implemented the first one yet.... that's what is wrong with that
|
|
