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swimfeeders
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30-01-2019, 02:52 AM
21

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by JBR ->
In all seriousness, I cannot think of any real benefit of remaining a member of the EU.

Some suggested benefits, such as the EHIC, are not exactly benefits at least to the country as a whole, as Europeans will not have the same benefit when we lose ours. Presumably it works both ways.

Some people do, of course, benefit from EU membership. Businessmen can freely import cheap labour from East European countries, whereas they cannot freely import people from outside the EU.
Hi

As I continually point out, Non EU Immigration is higher than EU Immigration

Things will have to change after Brexit, we will have to do a number of things.

We will have to start doing the unpopular jobs ourselves, the slaughterhouse stuff, recycling , sewage

We need to invest hundreds of millions in training, HGV Drivers, construction workers, engineering, nurses doctors.

We need to stop charging people to train in the vital jobs we need.

We are going to have to work harder, our productivity is worse than the French.

This will have to involve the unions, they will have to change and accept new working practices.

It is my view that the last one will be the most difficult, they are dinosaurs.
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Bruce
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30-01-2019, 06:28 AM
22

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

I would have thought free movement was a major benefit. You could live anywhere particularly somewhere that is not cold, wet and miserable and especially far from those gallahs in Westminster.
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Banchory
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30-01-2019, 07:06 AM
23

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by Bread ->
The environmental benefits of vacuum cleaners with 1600 watt motors?


Erm ?

What about german diesel cars and the lies they told about their emissions?
Strange how you chose to link environmental benefits rather than the advancement of engineering better motors to the reduction in wattage of motors but yes there is a small environmental benefit in less power consumption

Again you let your hatred of the EU blind you to fact. The EU do not own or control what German car makers do.

How were the EU responsible for VW, a privately owned company, altering software to cheat emissions testing?

Please explain what lies the EU told?

The VW scandal ultimately extended to testing over 20 manufacturers from all over the world and the findings were that real world emissions were universally way above EU limits

As far as Iím aware the only involvement the EU had was to respond to requests from numerous nations including the UK to temporarily relax standards until 2019 to ensure manufacturers cars could be leagally sold until change could be implemented.

The EU also took legal action against Germany and six other countries for failing to test vehicles properly

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.i...936.html%3famp

The UK governments knee jerk reaction to the diesel scandal the caused massive damage to parts of the UK car manufacturing industry

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.t...ry-sales-slump
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swimfeeders
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30-01-2019, 07:56 AM
24

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Hi

We blame the EU for so much which is our fault not theirs.

One of the big advantages of leaving is that our bunch of useless idiots will have nowhere to hide.

My vacuum cleaner, a Henry, is only 600 watts, absolutely brilliant and British Made.

We can do it, if we put our heads together.

The one thing that concerns me is the gung ho, Britain can be a major power again, punching above our weight.

There are proposals to build new military bases overseas.

Why?

My view is that we need to pull our necks in, slash overseas aid and concentrate on what we need to do to make life better here.
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Banchory
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30-01-2019, 08:55 AM
25

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by swimfeeders ->
Hi

As I continually point out, Non EU Immigration is higher than EU Immigration

Things will have to change after Brexit, we will have to do a number of things.

We will have to start doing the unpopular jobs ourselves, the slaughterhouse stuff, recycling , sewage

We need to invest hundreds of millions in training, HGV Drivers, construction workers, engineering, nurses doctors.

We need to stop charging people to train in the vital jobs we need.

We are going to have to work harder, our productivity is worse than the French.

This will have to involve the unions, they will have to change and accept new working practices.

It is my view that the last one will be the most difficult, they are dinosaurs.
Do you really believe this will happen?

Looking at just the first of your points

If leaving the EU restricts or makes the UK less attractive to migrant workers unless the benefits system is radically reformed a lot of the jobs these workers do wonít get done.
We could do something radical like UBI whereby there would be no disbenefit to undertaking casual or seasonal work but it would probably be as divisive as Brexit. On the plus side it would future proof the UK against the AI / automation revolution that is inevitable.

There is a general perception these unpopular job are undertaken by unskilled workers. This is far from the truth

An ex colleague of mine spent a few days working in local businesses as part of his companyís local community programme and he spent a couple of days ivkingbfruit and vegetables and one gay in a fruit packing plant. The skilled pickets and packers as he later called them were between 400 and 600% more efficient than him. He also witnessed a group of starters recruited via the job centre, none of which lasted the whole day. The pickets worked all over Europe, moving with the seasons and crops. The packaging plant workers were mainly well educated hard working people doing jobs the British donít want to do. The whole experience was a real eye opener for him
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gumbud
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30-01-2019, 09:02 AM
26

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Benefits of EU membership?
it might stop you discussing it for evermore?
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Moscow
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30-01-2019, 09:20 AM
27

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
Yes they did but they also reported on the environmental benefits and the advancement of engineering better motors

So, a mix of Debunked myths and reality with positive benefits

That statement on the false premise that it is only the EU that can pass laws that benefit the environment and create standards in engineering or product safety

That is a complete falsehood.

The UK will be more than capable to have it's own, better if deemed necessary, laws on anything it chooses.

You are obcviuosly not aware that EU safety standards are only in effect because they adopted the whole set of standards created by the BSI..........The British Standards Institute.

European goods were mostly a pile of crap before that.

The BSI is still in existence and will no doubt take a leading role post Brexit

Oh Ye of little faith.

You conflate your anti-Tory sentiments with anti-British sentiments.
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Moscow
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30-01-2019, 09:28 AM
28

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by swimfeeders ->
Hi

We blame the EU for so much which is our fault not theirs.

One of the big advantages of leaving is that our bunch of useless idiots will have nowhere to hide.

My vacuum cleaner, a Henry, is only 600 watts, absolutely brilliant and British Made.

We can do it, if we put our heads together.

The one thing that concerns me is the gung ho, Britain can be a major power again, punching above our weight.

There are proposals to build new military bases overseas.

Why?

My view is that we need to pull our necks in, slash overseas aid and concentrate on what we need to do to make life better here.
White a pile of nonsense...........The last thing Britain needs is a return to gun boat diplomacy.

The point of leaving is not necessarily because everything the EU does is bad, that is patently nonsense, it's because it can do it better without us and we can move in a direction that isn't dictated by and encumbered by EU membership.

But a return to Gun Boats ?..........of all the daft things you come out with that is right up there with the best.
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swimfeeders
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Shropshire
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30-01-2019, 09:34 AM
29

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by Banchory ->
Do you really believe this will happen?

Looking at just the first of your points

If leaving the EU restricts or makes the UK less attractive to migrant workers unless the benefits system is radically reformed a lot of the jobs these workers do wonít get done.
We could do something radical like UBI whereby there would be no disbenefit to undertaking casual or seasonal work but it would probably be as divisive as Brexit. On the plus side it would future proof the UK against the AI / automation revolution that is inevitable.

There is a general perception these unpopular job are undertaken by unskilled workers. This is far from the truth

An ex colleague of mine spent a few days working in local businesses as part of his companyís local community programme and he spent a couple of days ivkingbfruit and vegetables and one gay in a fruit packing plant. The skilled pickets and packers as he later called them were between 400 and 600% more efficient than him. He also witnessed a group of starters recruited via the job centre, none of which lasted the whole day. The pickets worked all over Europe, moving with the seasons and crops. The packaging plant workers were mainly well educated hard working people doing jobs the British donít want to do. The whole experience was a real eye opener for him
Hi

It will have to if Brexit is to work.

Seasonal Workers are not the issue, the plan is that we will be still be issuing permits for them.

We have done this for decades with no adverse effects.

Where do you think we get our sheep shearers from?

They come, earn a mint for a few weeks work and then leave.

It is the basic day to day jobs we need to fill, the weekend working, the 24 hour, 7 days a week, 365 days a year essential things which keep the country going.

This will involve huge changes to the Benefits System.

We have enough unemployed to fill these jobs, they choose not to, because it does not fit in with their views.

The State is not here to give us the lifestyle we want, it is a safety net for those who genuinely cannot work.

I wanted to go to University, not an option, I had to go to work to provide for the family.

I started work cleaning sewers by hand, worked my way up to Polytechnic, still working at nights and weekends, then Uni part time.

I spent four years stripping out pig guts to do this and it paid off.

I funded my post grads by getting a set of drain rods and cleaning drains to support my family.

Life is tough, nobody owes you a living.

I had to leave home and move away to get on in life.

This is the issue with the Corbyn supporters, they expect others to pay for their lifestyles.

I am happy to pay extra Tax for those who genuinely cannot work, and their carers.

I resent every penny of Tax going to those who think the state owes them a lifestyle they expect.
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swimfeeders
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30-01-2019, 09:40 AM
30

Re: Benefits of EU membership?

Originally Posted by Moscow ->
White a pile of nonsense...........The last thing Britain needs is a return to gun boat diplomacy.

The point of leaving is not necessarily because everything the EU does is bad, that is patently nonsense, it's because it can do it better without us and we can move in a direction that isn't dictated by and encumbered by EU membership.

But a return to Gun Boats ?..........of all the daft things you come out with that is right up there with the best.
Hi

Get real, I was arguing against it.

It is on the agenda.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-Far-East.html

This is just stupidity in my view.

You have completely misread my post, which was we should pull our necks in, slash overseas aid and concentrate on improving things for our own here in the UK.

I have no wish, intention or desire to remain in the EU in its present form.

A simple Free Trade Agreement would suit me fine.
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