Re: Fermented foods

Thanks for the tips about the Sourdough I agree about Rye as a starter, I have often created it without any whey (good bacteria).

Re the Sauerkraut, they usually recommend 2% salt of the cut cabbage. I use a little less, but 2% is a good 'safe' amount.

There are a few ways to make it. You can sprinkle some of the salt on the sliced cabbage and use your hands to 'squeeze' it until it starts to become wet and watery, or you can use things like a pestle and mortar if you are really serious, you can buy a proper kit which includes a 'stomper':



http://www.ms-steinzeug.com/Fermenta...-and-fork.html

That's actually the one I've got and the site I bought it off - it only took a few days to arrive, and I love it!

You can use Kilner-type jars if you don't fancy getting a fermenting pot. Just make sure that all of the cabbage is submerged under the juice and you use something like baking beads to keep it pressed down.

The best I have made though, is with my fermenting pot

If you want to go beyond cabbage, there are some brilliant books out there. Sander Katz is probably the best well known author. I generally stick to Sauerkraut as it is just so easy, and yes you can use the juice to inoculate other ferments (usually used for veg ferments).

Re: Fermented foods

Good info Azz cheers.

So . . . . does the end product taste fairly salty then ? If so do you dilute it later somehow?

Your fermenting pot looks nice.

I was considering getting 5 or 6 of these:



Basically ordinary Kilner jars fitted with special Sterilock tops which keep air out of the jar but which also allow CO2 to escape. I like the fact that the lids are unique and can be bought separately and as a result you can use see-through jars to watch the fermentation progress.

Re: Fermented foods

I used to use preserving jars (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kitchen-Home...s=preserve+jar) they are fine, just small (compared to the 10ltr pot).

Re salt, once you get the hang of it, you can experiment. I have used as low as 1% and it's turned out fine

Let us know how you get on!

Re: Fermented foods

Hmm but they have no airlocks so you would have to periodically open the lid to let CO2 gasses out which means air will get in surely?

The large pots like the one you showed have water locks don't they?

The salt levels are obviously important to kill off or greatly halt the replication/growth of bad bacteria so lowering the salt level presumably creates a risk.

With sourdough starters, when you first make them, there is an initial battle between natural yeasts, natural LABs and unwanted organisms. Provided the mixture is kept at the right temperature you create the perfect environment for the yeasts to flourish whilst the unwanted stuff is held back. The yeasts and LABs then quickly outnumber the unwanted organisms which naturally die off and get consumed.

So I assume that a similar process goes on with sauerkraut. The veg is covered in natural yeasts and LABs plus other unwanted organisms (beasties) and we need to create an environment which favours the LABs. It is the salt which holds back the replication of yeasts and beasties.

I'm making educated assumptions here based on my in depth knowledge of bread making and natural yeasts / yeast waters. The Katz book has been ordered and should arrive this week Hopefully that will explain all.

Re: Fermented foods

BTW I had a further thought about this sauerkraut method.
It seems that most recipes involve having to pound or mash the cut cabbage to get juices from it which seems like hard work and a bit of a faff.

Would it not be quicker and better to first take say a half of one cabbage and put that in a blender with salt and blitz the whole thing into a wet paste adding water as required.

Then chop the rest of the cabbages up normally and layer them in the jars with the blitzed cabbage.

I'm thinking this would accelerate the fermentation process whilst still giving a product with plenty of chunky cabbage bits. Any thoughts?

Re: Fermented foods

As long as the cabbage remains submerged under the juices it should be fine. When using the preserve jars I would place half leaves on the top and press down, then put lots of small baking beads on top - that way the cabbage is always under the fluid.

Preserve jars (like the one I linked to) can let out air as they are 'spring' loaded/closed. Either way you may want to check on it every few days to remove any mouldy bits that may form at the top.

I have made several jars at once and some of the jars have remained closed for weeks - most of them overflow anyway, as after a few days bubbles begin to form pushing fluid up and out - so always put the jars in a plastic bag or plate.

I would not advise the blender method - just do it the proper way

Re: Fermented foods

The Food Programme today on radio 4 was all about fermenting foods and had some very interesting information
Listen here...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b073655s