Re: Same old Labour!!!!

No Joe, you are wrong, Maggie did not do that, the greed of the unions and people did that. Had Maggie not done some of the things she is alleged to have done the country would be run by self opinionated union bosses..

May I add that Labour carried on selling this country's industry and gold reserves which would have seen us through any recession a lot easier.

Unions and people are always wanting more more and more money for doing less and less work so they priced themselves out of the market leaving industry no choice but to seek cheaper ways of producing products for our needs.

Jaguar are a prime example, in this country the made huge losses and went to a foriegn company to help produce their product, now they are huge making profits, granted that they are exploiting the cheap workforce but that workforce is just happy to have a job and dont think the world owes them a living.

Unions, PHTH,PHTH

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

[QUOTE=Antibrown;104789.
Jaguar are a prime example, in this country the made huge losses and went to a foriegn company to help produce their product, now they are huge making profits, granted that they are exploiting the cheap workforce but that workforce is just happy to have a job and dont think the world owes them a living.

Unions, PHTH,PHTH[/QUOTE]

I am sure Uncle Jo will be replying to you Antibrown, but I can't let this lie. Is it fair or just to exploit a cheap workforce (who have very little anyway) so that the few can make huge profits. None of the profits get ploughed back into help the people who work hard, they stay with the wealthy who intend to put as little back as they can. Just beause somebody can subsist on a few pence a day doesn't mean it is fair and equitable.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

I am sure Uncle Jo will be replying to you Antibrown, but I can't let this lie. Is it fair or just to exploit a cheap workforce (who have very little anyway) so that the few can make huge profits. None of the profits get ploughed back into help the people who work hard, they stay with the wealthy who intend to put as little back as they can. Just beause somebody can subsist on a few pence a day doesn't mean it is fair and equitable.[/QUOTE]


Perhaps Comrade Aerolor we should refer Antibrown to the Marxist pamphlet - "Wages, Prices and Profit".

I wonder whether Antibrown would be so keen on this Government if his pension was so badly affected by the Government's attack on it.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

Was it not Brown who destroyed the private Pension market by taking £30 billion out in a wind fall tax

Cut my final pay out but nearly half.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

Aerolor, I did not say that it is right to exploit the cheap workforce, I was mearly poining out that the Unions had price the countries workfoce out of the market. If someone will do the job cheaper they will get the work.
If a painter offered to paint your home for £500 and another said he would do it for £400, who would get the work?(Quality being equal).

Uncle Joe, I learnt a long time ago, back in the 50,s that the country would struggle to pay pensions in the future so I took precautions and made my future safe from government dependency.
If we only had our government pension to depend on we would get by, only just but we would survive. We always paid cash for our necessities and never borrowed,apart from the mortgage, mortgage paid off in the 90's, we now have no debts so our £200+/week government pension would see us through.
Ony people who want everything struggle with money.
Be thankful for what you have and look after the pence, the pounds will look after themselves.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

I don't think the Unions priced the countries workforce out of the market. What happened that was the emerging economies like India, China, etc. came into the market and it was impossible to compete because they produced everything so cheaply. That is why Marks and Spencer (for example) as well as other companies no longer advertise 100% British Made - they could not compete and even if they paid the "slave labour" wages that these countries could and still do pay. Many industries found this, e.g. cheap imported steel, cheap imported coal, cheap electonic stuff, cheap call centres, cheaper everything. America and other highly developed countries have also done the same. It became economical to either move factories out to these countries and use their labour force or give contracts to them instead of placing them in Britain or in their own country - because the wages were such a pittance and there were no employment or health and safety laws to safeguard the workforce.
Sorry Antibrown but would you want the the ordinary person to go back to working in the sweat shops of Victorian days, with child labour, living in slums, etc. etc.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

Definately not Aerolor but I would like to see people trying to help the country back on its feet instead of knocking everything that does not give them more money, we can not have everything we want.

You say that emerging economies like India, China came into the market and we could not compete because they produce things more cheaply. Does this not tell you that this country was and is overpaying the workers value? If people worked an 8 hour day then the value of the money paid to them would increase, instead we see people going to work for 8hours a day but only working around 6 hours a day if you take off the time they have for tea breaks, smoking and discussing last nights TV and washing their hands several times a day etc.

When I worked I did a 10 hour day (my choice) and only stopped for lunch, my workforce did the same only they did 8 hours not 10 and none of them complained, I did not stop tea breaks they did'nt because they knew that by helping my company they were helping themselves.
Work in Germany or Switzerland and you see people turning up for work well before their start time and then starting work and not stopping until lunch or home time, not slave labour just an honest days work, plus they are proud of the job that they are doing.

After the second world war people pulled together for the benefit of the country and the country prospered.
The unions in the 70's nearly did what Hitler could'nt, bring this country to its knees with their outrageous demands for more money and shorter hours.

I just think it is time that the people of this country got off their backsides and did something for the country instead of moaning and groaning at little thing.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

I do agree in lots of ways Antibrown - we have become a bit of a dependent culture, assuming that we will be bailed out and looked after whether we work or not. Like a lot of our generation, we worked hard with long hours, but we have reaped the reward for the endeavour and can look at things from a secure viewpoint. I don't think we will agree entirely about Unions - like many things the middle view is often the more sensible. I don't think all Union members are millitants, just as I think there must be some "good and honest" politicians. Never shut the door I think, always leave it a bit open for negotiation.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

All union members are definately not militants Aerolor, just the ones who can not accept authority.
Negotiations are the way forward, it is a pity that those negotiating always seem to have hidden agenda's.

There is nothing like putting ones cards on the table and talking openly without someone always semming to want more.

Re: Same old Labour!!!!

Ask for ten and accept five I always say