Re: Pensions

From Barry's postWhat we have to remember, is that it is only the private sector that generates the wealth required to pay public sector pensions. Unless the public services contribute more themselves we will eventually be bankrupted. It may seem unfair now, but to me, and all of the private sector generally, the thought of being taxed until death to continue to pay obscene public sector pensions, is almost criminal.

But not all public sector pensions are obscene Barry the vast majority are quite modest. The public sector provides essential services which we all pay for one way or another and provision for employee pensions is part of that price - they don't generate their own wealth - how can they, but you try and do without them!! Why should employees working in the public sector be penalised for working there. Some of the packages in private industry are far more extravagent and earned for far less endeavour. I am not talking about teachers, but if Jo Public only knew how hard some of those jobs are (and I suppose I am talking about the NHS because that's what I know). How many would or even could spend their working life in certain areas of care that NHS staff work in. There are no perks to the job and most of the time it is very hard graft in very unpleasant circumstances. Try being spit on, scratched, abused verbally and physically. Coping with emotions (rational and irrational), death, disease, muck and gunge and human frailty - all in a day's work?

Re: Pensions

I may be wrong but I understood the public sector pensions first came about because the wages were lower than those paid for similar occupations in the private sector. Also some of the jobs were vocational and the pension was seen as a just reward for giving up the opportunity of a better paid job or putting ones life at risk .

Over the years the differential between the two sectors has been eroded and with so many people working in the public sector or claiming benefits of one kind or another the public purse can no longer provide for so many.

Re: Pensions

I would argue to the contrary, that unless the government cracks down on the multi-billion tax avoidance industry and collects the taxes of the rich with the same enthusiasm that they collect PAYE from our meagre wages/pensions, we will eventually be bankrupted.

I am on a final salary Teachers pension and for me, that pension was part of the contract I had with local government. For forty years I would accept wages much lower than I would receive in a private sector job commensurate with my qualifications, in return I would get a liveable pension.
The government can't have it both ways.

Re: Pensions

Just one more comment and then I'm finished. I think that when people are knocking public sector pensions, they should think on that like other citizens, public sector employees also pay the same taxes, NI, VAT and all the other taxes that everyone else pays - so in that respect they do contribute to the economy of this country. Without the skills of staff working in the NHS many people in this country would be unable to work; without expert healthcare, surgery, etc., many people would not be fit enough.

Re: Pensions

I agree Aerolor, I now realise that there is a huge diversity of good/bad/right/wrong on this matter, and I can only sincerely apologise, to both to yourself and to anyone else that took umbrage at my hastily constructed, ill thought through diatribe...
Barry

Re: Pensions

Oh Barry, you don't need to apologise - I didn't take umbrage and I'm sorry for being so blunt. I often get on my "high horse" on behalf of the NHS - warts and all I will always defend it and the people who work there. My concerns are that we may throw away something precious to the well-being of people in this country and we may only value it when it has gone.

Re: Pensions

maggie thatcher carefully distroyed all of our jobs, and overseas workers are so used to bad living conditions and low wages they are happy to work like that over here, so stopping wages cabable of paying for pensions, I really worry for my kids, we will be back to prewar days in no time at all.
we have one young girl from bosnia who can not read or write and insists that selling the Big Issue is a career!

Re: Pensions

Maggie did not ruin our jobs, the Unions did that with excessive claims for more money and shorter hours longer tea breaks plus a 'washing hands' time at the end of the day.

I used to be a union official and I know what went on.

Re: Pensions

The country was on it's knees when Margaret Thatcher became Prime Minister, thanks to years of weak, pathetic, ineffectual Labour government and crippling demands from the unions. As will be the case now, clearing up after years of Labour waste and profligacy took a generation of abject misery, which is what you blame her for, when, in effect, she saved the country from absolute ruin. When Labour finally got in again, with the country doing very nicely thank you, they did the same all over again, and it was they who admitted all of the cheap workers who take all the jobs, not Mrs Thatcher. Memories are very short with Labour supporters, it amazes me that anyone, anywhere, would ever want to vote for them ever again..

Re: Pensions

I don't do politics at all because I don't profess to understand it most of the time, and I don't care who did what or when, but now.

I became a pensioner nearly two years ago (I'll be 62 in December) and I was happily surprised when I found out what I'd be receiving for my pension which then was £129.60 per week. This was reviewed in April this year and I now receive £138+ per week. For me, this is totally inadequate to keep body and soul together, so I continue to work part-time but, having said that, I get full pension because I've paid full stamp from being 15 years old.

You gets back what you puts in. Well, not quite. I've known people to pay into private pensions, only for them to go pear-shaped and for those people to have lost all that money and not a penny-piece in return. I am so glad that I didn't take out a private pension, and even happier that I didn't change to married woman's stamp when I got married in 1972.

Happily, I've now paid off my mortgage, which was the subject of another topic and yes, I am better off, marginally. I don't have to watch the pennies quite as much as I did before.

I reckon that when you retire, you should be given back all that you put in during your working life in a lump sum. My stars! I'd be a millionaire!