Hi

I agree with most of what you say Julie.

However I have to disagree about freedom of movement within the EU.

The UK is putting restrictions on EU Citizens coming to live or work here.

It is an inevitable consequence of this that the EU will do the same to UK Citizens wishing to live and work in the EU.

I can quite understand the concerns of the large number of retirees from the UK who live in the EU.

There are currently reciprocal tax arrangements in place for many types of Pensions, in particular State Pensions and some Public Service Pensions.

This means that many UK citizens pay UK taxes on these and our personal taxes are much lower than those in many EU Countries, in particular, we have a very large tax free allowance.

Not many French or Spanish people retire to the UK, but many UK Citizens retire to France and Spain.

It is not in the interests of those Countries to continue these arrangements.

Some little bird told me the USA is the most powerful and wealthy country in the world.
Some things are not desirable but being a large country doesn't mean they have to be slavishly followed.
There is nothing inherently wrong with being a large rich and powerful country. Especially when Russia and China are large rich and powerful nations.

Your poorer Brits are not doing too well and you aren't even part of a rich powerful nation. What makes you think being out of the EU will change that when there is even less money around for you? Hammond already promised austerity until 2020.

It is this kind of nonsense that I recoil from. There is not any certainty or in fact any reality in which what you want for the UK will happen. All your problems were not the EU but the policies the UK made over the last 45 years. And you threw out what made you able to be richer and more powerful and influential.
Even now the G7 thinks the UK is unimportant. The UK is giving away its clout.
If the UK had voted to leave the EU with any sort of prayer that it would benefit the country I could be getting on with doing other things. But I am angry (well me and 17 million other people) that those who do not understand what they called undemocratic, who wallowed the jingoistic rubbish in popular simplistic papers, who can do nothing but repeat common lies and who never once looked at the probable consequences, who assume that the young will do what they want because they made the decision (when did your last servant die off?) and who can't mount a defence of their actions except to say we won.
The whole exercise was a nonsense. And it has trashed the UK. And yes I am angry.

I understand that many ex pats will suffer a reduction in income, but if they chose to live elsewhere they cannot expect to get the best of both countries. Many who live in warmer parts of Europe have much lower heating bills, some come back to the UK for medical treatments. Food is charged at different rates in most European countries. Surely if you choose to live in another country, then you should expect to live with the same costs as the locals do. Ex pats have done very well out of these reciprocal arrangements, but the people who live in Britain need to look after their own needs, because the Ex pats are not likely to be thrown out of their new countries. I believe that Britain intends to allow EU immigrants to remain here, if they choose to.

The mess the Eu caused will have consequences, as has been said, I question why so many people change countries instead of staying and making their own great. All these professionals must be needed in their own countries we should be teaching our own. It used to be we were so well trained we went round the world training others, what's happened I can't understand but we need to get back to being best we can again.

Not quite true Twink. It may of course be much warmer here in the spring and summer months, but like many others you are making the mistake of thinking we don't get cold winters, we do, and believe me, you wouldn't want to spend a winter here without heating.

Those who return to the UK for medical treatment are either not resident here or are defrauding the system, which many Brits were doing until they altered the system here, now it is not so easy for them.

Hi

Now that I can totally agree with Julie.

As for leaving, well when you retire, you have done your bit for the Country.

You have worked hard, paid your taxes and it is now time to enjoy life.

For me, that means better weather and better fishing for six months of the year with the other six months spent here in the UK.

I see nothing wrong with that at all.

I do not have the close family that you have, so no reason not to spend my retirement as I see fit.

It isn't just the retirees. There are very many people who have businesses here, very many people who are bringing up their families here. Leaving the EU is going to affect them far more than the retirees. Plus of course when the professional people from the EU, i.e. Doctors, Vets, Teachers, etc etc, no longer feel welcome in the UK they too will return to their own countries, or countries within the EU.
If ,by some chance, British ex pats no longer feel welcome here then they too will return to the UK, and since, no doubt they have paid taxes and NI there during their working lives, will expect to be treated as the British citizens they are. However, they will not be replacing the professional people who will leave the UK.

So do you think it is fair that you pay tax at the same rate that the Spanish do?

You are making assumptions again, aren't you?

Give it a couple of years and come back, and admit to me that you were wrong and that professional and probably other productive people are still working as ex-pats in both the UK and the EU.

Make a note: post no. 128 in the 'Oh dear, the EU...' thread.

(She won't! )