11 +

D/D was telling me this morning that the parents of a child in the class of one of her children has raised Merry Hell.
The reason being "She was bullied by the class-- what?"
and couldn"t perform to the best of her ability, in the 11 +
Bearing in mind this a child who spent 4 weeks, before the exam , in the USA, and was voted as vice captain of the house/teams as I am sure all you know , has been going on for ever.
So that is hardly the actions of bullies.
What is happening these days ?

Re: 11 +

I am sure a lot of people wont like this, but I think that bullying is often used as an excuse for failure. If children weren't molly coddled they would be able to stand up for themselves..... as most of us had to do!

Re: 11 +

Well funny you should say that Twink , the child in question, an only child and every whim is pandered to .
Which is a bit foolish in my opinion, as it a tough old world out there and they must learn to stick up for themselves.

Re: 11 +

11+ exams?
I thought this kind of cruel streaming had been abolished late 60's?

As for the bullying issue.
It's a funny thing that bullies often claim they are the victims of bullying themselves.
Queen bees are often serial bullies, but don't please underestimate the damage bullying can and often does do.

There is a difference between teaching children to be resilient and teaching children they should suffer in silence!

Re: 11 +

Many of us think it was a good thing, or at least that grammar schools should be re-instated.

One concession I would make is that perhaps we shouldn't rely on a single exam to determine who is sufficiently capable. Several tests could be conducted at around the same time which could account for the inevitable 'bad days'.

Re: 11 +

Determining a child's fate at 11 years old is completely short sighted and cruel.

Kids at 11 have no idea if they will ultimately be more suited to a profession requiring University or a profession requiring technical studies, or a profession that requires something between the two or neither.

All the 11+ ever did was frighten the socks off kids and keep the slow starters or those with less engaged parents, or those with disadvantaged backgrounds firmly in the "must try twice as hard" cohort.

Disgusting outmoded social engineering at its worst.

Re: 11 +

So at what age would you make the decision on which type of school would best suit a child?

The longer it is left, the less effective time available to develop the child's knowledge.

Re: 11 +

I thought streaming a great idea , bring it back .... maybe with another 'look' at ages 13 and 15 too

Re: 11 +

a child can make his or her own decision once past the basics at 15 or 16.

There's little point in doing this earlier.
Every child needs maths, english and other core knowledge before they can specialize and go on to more accademic studies, trades or even leave school.
So what's the point in separating them at 12?
Bored kids or kids that have no interest disrupt the swat's you may say?

Sorry, that's a failing of a school generally and shoving them into a school where the pests can just disrupt the others there is pointless.
Kids taking more hands on studies like engineering, domestic science, woodwork etc are just as deserving of a decent school environment without the pests.

We have a whole separate building for "the horror years" 14-15..(ordinary state high school)
Large teaching areas that can accommodate 30-40 students for classes ..with smaller pod rooms off side...three teachers..one for the main group, two to take the pests or the opposite off for some more catered tuition in the pods.

The next year..the kids make their curriculum elective choices....seems to work quite well...fewer leave at 15-16.

They can continue with basic maths and english and take specialist subjects (like engineering) at another school one day per week.

Re: 11 +

I think a social situation has more effect on educational development, than the educational structure itself, yes, the educational structure creates opportunity, but a child's social situation will dictate if this opportunity can be capitalized upon.