Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Oh it can muddy, our late Duncan was fearful that fear come out as aggression towards dogs and people, children especially. We worked hard with him and he never bit anyone but he was always fearful

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

He wouldn't be touching mine either.

From what I've seen of him, I don't like him or his methods one bit.

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Was he a small dog Julie ?
Small dogs are often quite aggressive
A bit like people
Short people often seem to be overly aggressive
Like Bamtem chickens who always want to take on the big cockerels

In fact Ceasar Milan does go into fear aggression quite a lot .
He can tell by the bark and attitude of the dog what aggression is motivated by fear .
Many of his cases are chihuahuas who are notorious biters .

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Muddy fear of other dogs large or small can make a dog 'fear aggressive'. They apply the 'freeze flight or fight ' principle. My dog is fear aggressive with other dogs because she was attacked as a puppy.
She can't use her 'flight' response if on a lead so she can freeze or fight and would choose the latter to 'get in first'.
We have to approach other dogs with caution using positive reinforcement/distraction methods.

Fear can cause a dog to attach a child based on 'fear association' I will give you an example, if a child hurts a dog it may associate a child/children with the pain it felt on a previous occasion and attack through fear of further pain .

Not so, many people are unaware of the importance of socialisation and don't do it.

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

I never blame a child for being attacked by a dog .
Many dogs attack children not because they have been hurt by a child but that they see a child that as weaker member of the pack .
Further down the pecking order .
In the same way a horse if attacked by a stronger member of its herd will turn about and bite another below it in the pecking order
Dog owners should never leave a young child alone with a dog .
I have had many dogs over the years from horrendous circumstances in third world countries .
Some of these have been big potentially dangerous animals
I have touch wood never been bitten nor have my children. but I am always careful with dogs especially those that have come from bad places
Usually these dogs are pathetically grateful and happy to be in a good home and don't cause a problem .
But they have issues as do children from bad upbringings
It is as is often seen in Ceasar milans programmes the dogs can also come from spoil but affluent enviroments .
Some people would have difficulty in controlling a goldfish much less a dog
They are potentially a dangerous creature .
Luckily most dogs are not like this .
I agree that some people simply do not socialise their dogs properly which is best done when they are small.
Like children unacceptable behaviour in dogs is just not acceptable .
Blaming it on children I notice is a great excuse for having a dog with unacceptable sociable habits .
My children love dogs and always have .
But young children can be rough and generally puppies don't have a problem with that as they are rough too.
Of course too rough with a little dog will result in a bite.
Therefore small children and dogs must always be monitored .

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

You are way out of date with your ideas of 'the pack concept' Muddy that has dismissed as not being valid long ago.

Try reading the latest research including the paper 'Dominance in domestic dogs: useful construct or bad habit?'
by Bradshaw, J, Blackwell, E & Casey of University of Bristol School of Veterinary Sciences to get a little more up to date with canine behaviour .

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Duncan was nervous when we got him had spent first 8 months of his life shut in a shed, was scared of trees and grass, his aggression started after he was neutered the vet said the lack of testosterone caused it. His fear just went off the scale.

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Because someone dismisses and opinion dosent mean they are right!
As we can see quite clearly on the many discussions of the afterlife !
A dog still has many instincts of the wolf and a study of the lives of wolves and wild dogs show the importance of the pack and each dogs place in the pack.
I have lived and worked with horses all my life and know that on all groups of horses there is a pecking order.
There are as many ways to train animals as their are children .
All work to an extent .
As I said before Cesar Milan is dealing with dogs that are already compromised .
His methods work .

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Dogs aren't wolves, that is the first mistake people made when they said dogs were pack animals.

Re: Cesar Millan (split from Barbara Woodhouse thread )

Oh dear I can see I am wasting my time Muddy . I will leave you to go on admiring someone who thinks torturing a dog is acceptable.