Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

I think you've made your point Realist, which is welcome of course, but I don't think we need to hear it repeating over and over.

You said all this last time there was a dieting thread, and we told you then, that some ladies like the companionship and friendship of going out one evening a week to their slimming clubs. It is not hurting you, is it?

I can hear you tutting already.

We do realise that in a perfect world no one would ever get overweight in the first place, we would all be slim and healthy and live forever, but this isn't a perfect world is it.

Many people do get overweight for a variety of reasons, that is what happens - accept it.
But if they have become overweight, then it is a good thing to realise it and try in their own way to put it right.

Please try to understand other's points of view sometimes.

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

I think you are right Mups. It seems the group I am going to is made up of local ladies who enjoy the "get together" each week. They have a bit of a giggle and not all of the talk is about slimming.

It is very easy to eat too much of the calorie laden foods these days. Everything is so easy to obtain - you don't have to cook everything from scratch and many people do not cook like they did years ago. The variety of foods on offer is also vast. There is a fast food shop on almost every corner and the temptations are enormous for many people.

I also think there is a significant amount of psychology attached to food and eating. As mothers and wives women are used to "providing" and many like to think of themselves as good cooks and providers. The giving of food and sweet stuff is also a way of showing you love someone. There is a significant social element surrounding food and eating together as well. It can get difficult to "turn off" or limit these things - it is all so enjoyable.

Do folks think it is more difficult for a woman to lose weight than a man? Do men have more willpower or not? Is it possible to eat simply to survive and no more - do more men fall into this category than women?

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

I agree with you. Bottom line is at least we are trying, regardless of the method. I know Realist is trying to save us from the world of "yo-yo dieting" and I can completely appreciate that. He makes wonderful points and, admittedly, he's right. But sometimes we have to live and learn on our own.

Just because we're older now doesn't mean we know everything there is to know about weight loss.

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

Aerolor, I used to love the social aspect of WW. It was such a friendly group and everyone was genuinely supportive and of course the topic wasn't always about weightless, we talked about everything that was affecting our lives. I think thats part of why slimming clubs do so well. Women are " allowed" to go and its a bit of time for themselves. Im not saying that anyone stops us from going out socialising, but we all know how guilty we feel having time out from the family and taking "me time"

As for me, well the men my husband age and even younger are all fat. My husband would be as well if he didn't have such a physical job and that I ensure he gets a balanced diet.

He works with a fella in his late 20s and his lunch box will be a 6 pack of wagon wheels and a coupe of bags of crisps or a pack of sausage rolls

The boys in work, they bring in crisps and chocolate bars for their pack lunch, no sandwiches or soup or anything halfway decent. Oh they are skinny now but the bad habits are being ingrained

I do cook from scratch every day. for us a take out is a treat, not every week and certainly not every day. I do try to eat a balanced healthy diet but my bad habits like drinking too much , not getting enough exercise etc have contributed to me piling on the pounds

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

No but it's hurting them which is why it is so important to hammer the point home. Too many are trapped in this deluded Matrix of being overweight, hating the fact that they are overweight and constantly deluding themselves that they want to do something about it and following diet after diet, club after club.

It's similar to smokers who know that what they are doing is idiotic and say they want to stop but they just don't. Hence they are deluding themselves when they say they want to stop. You can stop anytime. Just don't put another cigarette in your mouth. Really.

Being overweight is the same. Either you truly care about your body and understand that it is just a vessel and that it needs healthy food, or, you don't. It's that simple.

Diets, slimming clubs, gyms etc etc are all the purview of the deluded masses who want to outwardly show that they want to get well, when in fact they don't really. The ego still rules the roost and will continue to cripple the body through unhealthy eating and drinking.

If you are overweight you CAN STOP and change immediately. You can simply make the life decision to give your body the fuel it needs, good fuel, healthy fuel and nothing else.

From the moment that choice is made, health will follow and as a by-product, weight will drop off.

Slimming clubs are nothing but a lame excuse. A total delusion. A way to temporarily pacify yourself and at the same time drown your sorrows in the company of similarly afflicted people so you don't feel as bad about yourself.

It's like "hey, I'm massively overweight but look, so are all these other people so that's ok, it's not all bad, we're all in it together".

But it remains a total delusion. A continuing self denial. You're there because you refuse to make that life decision to simply give the body what it needs. No diets or clubs are necessary. You don't need to pay anyone money to resolve your issues. In fact take those slimming club subscriptions and go to the supermarket and buy a load of fresh vegetables and fruit with them!

The reason this is all so important is because people are trapped in this delusional Matrix and the slimming clubs are simply exploiting vulnerable people for profit and at the same time ensuring their bad health is not only perpetuated but sadly also worsened. Most gain more weight after losing a bit because the clubs offer diets not food education.

Take your money and go see a real nutritionist and have a couple of sessions. It will be money well spent. Their business model is not based on repeat business. You go once/twice, get educated and then you can fend for yourself.

No silly diets just proper understanding of food and nutrition, a life skill to take with you.


Yep but the rub is they are NOT trying their own ways are they? They are trying diets that are spoon-fed to them or they are following slimming clubs who spoon-feed drivel that will see them worse off in time.

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

But most slimming clubs are promoting healthy eating, same as you say 'drivel' that nutritionists would feed us?

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

I'm out of this thread ladies - sorry. This constant 'know-all' attitude has caught me in the wrong mood tonight, and I've had enough.
I will not be told what to do at my age by someone who knows sod all about my life, or any of our lives come to that.

Any reasonable post Realist might make is totally ruined by his consistent, and never-ending nagging and bullying IMO.

Realist, if you can't accept other people's viewpoints and respect their feelings, why can't you just say - "I beg to differ" and leave it at that?
You go on and on and on . . . . . and on . . . . it is unbelievably tiresome.
You are one of those people who seem to have an obsession with talking down to everyone who doesn't fall into line and agree with your every word you say.
May I suggest you live your life however you wish, but leave others to do the same.

Apologies ladies, he has just caught me in the wrong mood with his arrogance this time.

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

Aww Mups, don't go. It's nice how more people have come to this thread and we can lean on each other, give and get advice and even vent, if we need to.

Realist, your advice is appreciated. But constantly telling us that we're doing it all wrong, ruining our lives and living in a world of delusion is rather derogatory and unnecessary. We need support, not insults.

Yes, the slimming clubs take their money. But it's their money and it's how they choose to spend it. That's not a concern of anyone else's. I say "they" because I'm not enrolled in a slimming club. I'm not really into them, but some women (and even men) are and I myself have tried them in the past. And if they enjoy it, then let them enjoy it instead of telling them they're living a lie. It's their prerogative and where they find support.

Again, good advice is always welcomed. But give advice in a positive way instead of making us feel like a bunch of nincompoops who have no idea what we're doing.

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

Errrr nope I don't agree at all.

As I said a few time, the slimming clubs have a business model. They don't exist for altruistic reasons, to make you healthy. They exist to generate $millions, which they do, every year.

If these clubs really did promote healthy eating then you'd gain the food education you need and then never ever have a need to go back. Really just think that through.

I mean sure, you might "fall off the wagon" and eat badly again for a while but if that happened, you wouldn't need to ever go back to a slimming club, you'd just go back to using the food education you learned and adjust your eating.

Their business model relies on people repeatedly coming back over and over. They cream vulnerable people for weekly subscriptions and their model means they have to continually come up with the next super great eating "tricks" which then allows them to publish ad sell a whole new set of books and recipes and other nonsense to these vulnerable people. I mean just think through the iterations of the different "new" ways they have had to come up with to entice vulnerable people back and give them the (totally false) hope that this new different way will be the one that does it this time . . . .

Calorie counting, red and green days, syn counting, food combination eating . . . .

yada yada yada

It's all total BS, sorry but has to be said. It's a $multi-million dollar business raking in the profits at your expense.
Worse still, they have now managed to hook up with the NHS who now steer people to the clubs. Make the whole thing seem even more legit and ok.

I looked at some of the sample recipes of these clubs and guess what, some of the ingredients they were suggesting were sugar laden. Jars of passata sauce for example. No mention there of finding one without the sugars or making your own. Absolutely no mention of the effects of taking in sugars without intake of fibre. Like I said it is NOT food education. It is a false spoon-feeding of recipes, and a diet eating regime. That is a VERY different thing to food education. It's a system that says essentially:

"look we know you've failed at trying to eat properly yourself so sit back and let us tell you what meals to create and eat and when"

Their aim is simply to make a temporary change to your eating (they absolutely know it will be temporary) and as a result of that they know you WILL lose a small amount of weight and that creates the short term (half information) publicity they need to generate more customers.

The reality is that the vast majority of club members will regain the weight once the temporary eating changes cease and revert back to norm and a great many of those people put on more weight besides.

Anyway, each to their own. The truth needs to be told though because too many vulnerable people are caught in this hopeless cycle and are feeding the system that makes people worse.

Re: I just can't do it without counting calories

No-one is telling you what to do. I am simply relating my views on dieting and slimming and the continuing insipid cycle that many are locked into.

I haven't bullied anyone. Just stated my opinions and facts.
Try not to take it personally. There will always be contrary views on an open forum. It used to bother me too many years ago but I learned that on forums there is such a diverse cross-section of views and knowledge that it becomes important to know your stuff.

Debate and discussion isn't about feelings as such. It's a constant exchange of views and ideas, questions and answers, assertions and responses.

I don't personally believe I talk down to anyone. I do believe that many vulnerable people are duped by the dieting merchants and slimming clubs and are fooling themselves. In the end you can consider the views I offer or reject them, it's your choice. Happy either way.