17-12-2018, 01:42 AM
111
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by JBR
->
May has made mistake after mistake and the consequence is that her party have had it..
There will be plenty of reward for her later in the EU when her time here is done.
17-12-2018, 07:35 AM
112
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Realist
->
I don't think she's made mistakes. She has merely agreed to be the EU patsy. To put on the show for them, and do whatever they tell her to do. It will have been agreed from the outset that her pantomime part is one that will see her boo'd off the stage and removed from office. She's happy to play that part. She is effectively the EU in our government which is why she's tabling a deal that doesn't actually see us leave the EU at all.There will be plenty of reward for her later in the EU when her time here is done.
Hi
No, no and no.
She was elected by the Tory Party, which included the Brexiteers.
The rampant ones, Boris, Davies, Fox etc.
She gave them free reign to deliver on their promises.
All three of them failed big time.
Boris, as Foreign Secretary, was a disaster, he pissed off everyone.
The face of Brexit, he was tasked with opening doors for Trade Deals.
He insulted so many, he alienated them.
David Davies, in charge of delivering Brexit with the EU.
He rarely went to Brussels
An idle sod, when he did go, he just made demands, you need us more than we need you.
He vetoed any preparations for No Deal.
Waste of money, they will cave in.
Liam Fox, in charge of Trade Deals.
So arrogant he told the Countries we have Trade Deals with as part of the EU, forty odd of them, what they will be getting.
No Negotiation, we will deal with it by means of Technical Rectification.
He was told to Naff off.
He was so pissed out of his head on one flight, he had to be taken away from the journalists.
Result, formal complaints to the WTO.
These will take years to resolve and this will cost us £Billions.
Welcome to even more Austerity.
A complete bunch of tossers.
The only Brexiteer who came out of this with any credibility was Farage.
My Politics are miles away from his, with the exception that we need to leave.
He knew the system, but was ignored.
17-12-2018, 08:20 AM
113
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by swimfeeders
->
HiNo, no and no.
She was elected by the Tory Party, which included the Brexiteers.
The rampant ones, Boris, Davies, Fox etc.
She gave them free reign to deliver on their promises.
All three of them failed big time.
Boris, as Foreign Secretary, was a disaster, he pissed off everyone.
The face of Brexit, he was tasked with opening doors for Trade Deals.
He insulted so many, he alienated them.
David Davies, in charge of delivering Brexit with the EU.
He rarely went to Brussels
An idle sod, when he did go, he just made demands, you need us more than we need you.
He vetoed any preparations for No Deal.
Waste of money, they will cave in.
Liam Fox, in charge of Trade Deals.
So arrogant he told the Countries we have Trade Deals with as part of the EU, forty odd of them, what they will be getting.
No Negotiation, we will deal with it by means of Technical Rectification.
He was told to Naff off.
He was so pissed out of his head on one flight, he had to be taken away from the journalists.
Result, formal complaints to the WTO.
These will take years to resolve and this will cost us £Billions.
Welcome to even more Austerity.
A complete bunch of tossers.
The only Brexiteer who came out of this with any credibility was Farage.
My Politics are miles away from his, with the exception that we need to leave.
He knew the system, but was ignored.
That's Bullshit.
May made it perfectly clear from the moment she took office that SHE and SHE alone was in charge of the exit negotiations and that the buck stopped with HER.
SHE hamstrung all the Brexit supporting appointees by trying to negotiate a Remainer freindly agenda that was aligning us far too closely to the EU.
She did NOT give them free rein to deliver......
Never..........
Not Once.....
It was HER way or the highway
It was HER red lines
Unfortunately, it is HER farce and no-one else's.
I'm no fan of the Tories, but I'm less of a fan of LYING to promote your own partisan agenda.
17-12-2018, 09:43 AM
114
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Moscow
->
That's Bullshit.May made it perfectly clear from the moment she took office that SHE and SHE alone was in charge of the exit negotiations and that the buck stopped with HER.
SHE hamstrung all the Brexit supporting appointees by trying to negotiate a Remainer freindly agenda that was aligning us far too closely to the EU.
She did NOT give them free rein to deliver......
Never..........
Not Once.....
It was HER way or the highway
It was HER red lines
Unfortunately, it is HER farce and no-one else's.
I'm no fan of the Tories, but I'm less of a fan of LYING to promote your own partisan agenda.
17-12-2018, 11:01 AM
115
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Julie1962
->
Everyone involved appears to have gone to her with their own negotiated deals and had them shot down by her, that's ha;f the problem I think, they were negotiating then she'd stick her oar in and EU had no idea then what we wanted. She has been the main problem all along.
If there was a plan, we'd be holding a couple of aces instead of a bum deck!
17-12-2018, 11:40 AM
116
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
We can't agree any trade deal with the EU until we have left the block. It is illegal for the EU to negotiate and make trade deals with any member state so here is what I think could happen...My view is that May is simply running the clock down to a point where both sides agree to use the 2 year transition period to negotiate and implement the trade deal, bit by bit and step by step over this period. The advantage is that it means an extension of A50, but without actually extending it and admitting defeat (this would be very bad for the conservatives and could even force a general election).
So basically, we have a hard Brexit in March 2019, but with the benefit of a very soft landing, as all of the EU rules apply until we diverge from each part over the 2 year transition/implementation period.
As far as the UK and the EU are concerned, it benefits both sides, we get the trade deal implemented and put our UK systems in place, the EU gets the 39 billion over the transition period (and possible a 3rd year), while in the UK we have a managed exit that is done in a controlled way over the 2 years.
The backstop is (in my opinion) just a way to waste time ... so far 2 years have been used to negotiate a hard border that nobody will implement. At the last minute there will be a ammendum to the withdrawal bill which will allow it to pass through parliament... when this happens, no more 2nd referendum is possible... around 21st January.
After the 2 year implementation period, we will be out fully but with bilateral agreements with the EU to safeguard trade etc.
17-12-2018, 12:34 PM
117
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Realist
->
I don't think she's made mistakes. She has merely agreed to be the EU patsy. To put on the show for them, and do whatever they tell her to do. It will have been agreed from the outset that her pantomime part is one that will see her boo'd off the stage and removed from office. She's happy to play that part. She is effectively the EU in our government which is why she's tabling a deal that doesn't actually see us leave the EU at all.There will be plenty of reward for her later in the EU when her time here is done.
How about when she was Home Secretary? Was she on the EU's payroll then too?
17-12-2018, 12:40 PM
118
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Moscow
->
That's Bullshit.May made it perfectly clear from the moment she took office that SHE and SHE alone was in charge of the exit negotiations and that the buck stopped with HER.
SHE hamstrung all the Brexit supporting appointees by trying to negotiate a Remainer freindly agenda that was aligning us far too closely to the EU.
She did NOT give them free rein to deliver......
Never..........
Not Once.....
It was HER way or the highway
It was HER red lines
Unfortunately, it is HER farce and no-one else's.
I'm no fan of the Tories, but I'm less of a fan of LYING to promote your own partisan agenda.
BTW, the accepted word is 'Bollox', not 'Bullshit'.
17-12-2018, 12:41 PM
119
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Tedc
->
The Cabinet remainers, like Hammond, etc., are so confident that they can wreck Brexit that they have not been funding, or planning, anything for a possible exit.If there was a plan, we'd be holding a couple of aces instead of a bum deck!
17-12-2018, 12:45 PM
120
Re: Dark Days Ahead...And We Can't Even Vote Ukip!
Originally Posted by Bread
->
We can't agree any trade deal with the EU until we have left the block. It is illegal for the EU to negotiate and make trade deals with any member state so here is what I think could happen...My view is that May is simply running the clock down to a point where both sides agree to use the 2 year transition period to negotiate and implement the trade deal, bit by bit and step by step over this period. The advantage is that it means an extension of A50, but without actually extending it and admitting defeat (this would be very bad for the conservatives and could even force a general election).
So basically, we have a hard Brexit in March 2019, but with the benefit of a very soft landing, as all of the EU rules apply until we diverge from each part over the 2 year transition/implementation period.
As far as the UK and the EU are concerned, it benefits both sides, we get the trade deal implemented and put our UK systems in place, the EU gets the 39 billion over the transition period (and possible a 3rd year), while in the UK we have a managed exit that is done in a controlled way over the 2 years.
The backstop is (in my opinion) just a way to waste time ... so far 2 years have been used to negotiate a hard border that nobody will implement. At the last minute there will be a ammendum to the withdrawal bill which will allow it to pass through parliament... when this happens, no more 2nd referendum is possible... around 21st January.
After the 2 year implementation period, we will be out fully but with bilateral agreements with the EU to safeguard trade etc.
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