Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

Firstly your work pension comes out of money that you put in and not from public service purse. A substantial amount is deducted per month from your hard earned salary and not from public sector funds.

Unfortunately it has become rather fashionable of late for the ill informed to take a swipe at hard working individuals

I saw my job as a vocation and dedicated my working life as many others to the NHS and not the private sector.

We politely smiled at all the criticism.

I do not have to go that anymore but I will defend colleagues still in the service.

Blame successive governments and the people on the boards for mismanagement of funds and not take a swipe at hard earned pensions or information from a person who once knew a person ........

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

The Agencies are of course there to make a profit and it stands to reason that if you are paying a fee to a profit making organisation on top of what would be a basic wage to employ a nurse it is not an efficient use of resources.

Agencies should only be used as a last resort and more bank nurses made available.

I am guessing hospitals operate their bank systems if they have one like the nursing home sector but I could be wrong. 'Bank staff' or what you could call emergency relieve workers 'fill in as and when needed' and so are often on zero hours contracts because they may or many not be called in to work and are under no obligation to take work when it is offered to them if it is not convenient .
ZHC are frowned on by many who think these workers are being exploited but it is a system that works for many.

The alternative is to offer a number of contracted hours although the person may not be required. You could do this and pay a retainer to on call staff which may be less expensive than using agency staff.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

My last thread as I will be away for a time.

Nursing auxiliaries now phased out and replaced with nursing assistants again faced cuts, young mums and auxiliaries were the backbone of the NHS. Invaluable.

When they introduced boards, and several tiers of management, all funded from budgets to produce another hair brained scheme. These pen pushers decided the fate of your trust.

It worked when ward sisters and consultants had control. Control was taken away from them many years ago.

For the trust I worked for and because of near bankruptcy. Bank nursing was a thing of the past as there was simply no money.

The Welsh Assembly also I introduced free prescriptions.

The biggest drain on resources is A & E often used as a GP practice.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

The Tories are fleecing the NHS. Selling off the profitable bits to their sponsors and running down the rest so we will have to pay privately to get decent treatment. Hunt is still in the new government and he, like his cousin and predecessor in the job, Virginia Bottomley, has family connections in BUPA. The Private Health Care company that gains the most benefit from the running down of the NHS.

It's not rocket science! Nursing agencies are profiting from the destruction of the NHS and so are all the rest of the private health care companies. Who owns the companies?

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

You may want to check your facts on that statement Goldie.. You will probably find that your personal contributions were deducted before your pay was taxed thereby giving you tax relief on those. Your employer in your case the NHS, also makes contributions, usually at least as much as the employee, more likely considerably more.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

Nurses get a public sector pensions.
Public sector pensions are funded by the taxpayer.
Public sector offer a higher return than private sector pensions for two reasons.

Firstly, the government set a more generous return anyway in relation to the employees (that yours) relatively low contributions, which I also believe the government has been trying to address and balance out fairly over the last few years. Fair to the taxpayer that is as continuing 'guaranteed' public sector pensions have become an unaffordable burden.

Secondly, the pensions are 'ring fenced' which means they are cushioned against economic downturns unlike people in the private pension market where some people saw their pensions significantly reduced if not wiped out.

Meanwhile .. this thread is about nurses who opt to take higher payed work with agencies .. whilst retaining their link with the NHS to avail themselves of the perks and benefits available to them.

Whilst I can understand them doing that, who wouldn't want more pay ... they can then hardly complain that the NHS is strapped for cash. They are part of the problem.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

It's not a case of solely blaming the nurses ... but think of it this way.

You have a plumber come to your house to do some work.
He brings two chaps, his own workers he employs.
The next day he brings the same two chaps but at outside agency rates so instead of say, £12 an hour, they're now earning £25 an hour and the cost of the job has gone up. Either you pay the increase or the boss has to absorb it without, hopefully, doing this job at a loss.
You might not mind this if you don't have to settle the bill yourself ..
until
they do a bad job and you don't know whether the plumber is liable or the outside agency contractors is
or ..the plumber tries to cut corners, offer you an inferior service or you get told you'll have to join a waiting list to have your shower fitted because though you're entitled to it as part of the job the plumber can't afford to do it yet unless ... he can charge the excess privately.

That is mismanagement of funds... though in the NHS's case the labour bill is only a part of the overall problem.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

I am sure that is right Rainmaker, in fact in my job my employer gave me a pay rise to cover my contributions when I had to start contributing to my pension. My job involved advising people on pensions and investments and the rule was never to suggest a private pension to somebody who was getting a works pension, because they were never as lucrative to the person who would get the pension.
Private pensions are usually invested in safe investments but we always had to advise that these investments could go down as well as up so we could never guarantee how much pension would be paid from the annuity it purchased. A work pension was usually the safest bet, until companies started tapping into the pension fund when in financial difficulties, but very few companies actually did that and I am sure the NHS didn't.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

A good summing up Twink.
How many work pensions have hit the news headlines for theiving and filching of their employees funds.
The government don't. They fulfil their obligation toward pensions which means any shortage of funds hits other areas.
In the NHS's case ... it hits the service the public receive.

Re: Are Nursing Agencies fleecing the NHS?

So this won't turn into a long laborious thread.

Like all employee pension schemes both public and the private sector. Like the government are trying to introduce to all in the work place now. All benefit from tax relief

I paid in from 18 years of age.

So now you have another target, Royal Mail public sector now privatised, council run scheme, tax offices.

Your argument seems to be with private nursing agencies surely and the trust's boards who dole out the money.

Go and complain about the British culture of living off benefits.

Benefit Britain.